Wez
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‘Instead of being a pedantic bore, how about addressing the actual meat of my argument?’
So what is the ‘actual meat’ of your argument? That the ruling class of China is superior in some way to that of the US or European nations? I’m afraid that socialists find that kind of meaningless debate futile and boring.TS wrote: “It was the Europeans, principally the UK, France and Poland that were trying to encourage Germany and the USSR to fight it out against one another. The Soviets were aware of this and signed the non-aggression pact so that those powers would have to join the fight the Soviets knew was coming.”
This is all very ‘bourgeois’ in identifying a whole nation with it’s ruling class and it’s economic/imperialist interests. The ideologies of nationalism and religion were used to disguise the real motives for war of which, as usual, the vast majority were unaware. The idea that all ‘Europeans’ were trying to encourage Germany and the USSR to fight it out is just nonsense. Also the idea that the ‘Soviets’ still existed in Russia at that time is likewise nonsense.
TS – why should any socialist give a flying f**k about the Machiavellian tactics of Stalin or any of the other parasitic warlords of the time? The only important element is the reasons why the working class was willing and able to murder each other for no other reason than these power hungry degenerates desired it. The second world war was just a sequel to the unfinished business of the first world war which was enabled by the leftist betrayal of the second international.
ALB – You’re asking the likes of George Monbiot to accept a level of determinism no idealist will tolerate – presumably like the rest of his ilk he will insist on the existence of ‘free will’ and the ability of the individual to make moral choices.
‘In any event, scandals involving the ruling class are of no interest to socialists. Even if they were all saints they would still be exploiters and privileged parasites.’
Agreed ALB, but isn’t always worth pointing out the hypocrisies of the ruling parasites especially when their political lickspittles drone on about the importance of ‘law and order’ and that justice applies equally to all?ALB – You have to be careful when labeling anything as a ‘conspiracy theory’ since this is a favourite ploy used by the mainstream media to dismiss anything that is not ‘on message’ from their employers. Were the WMDs a conspiracy theory? The cover-up of Saville’s crimes a ‘conspiracy theory’? Going back was the Zinoviev letter or the Dreffus affair conspiracy theories? Just occasionally conspiracy theories are true.
Crikey, it’s a sad state of affairs if the bourgeois state can’t cover up the misdeeds of one of it’s own – I’d ask for a tax refund if I was him.
I always enjoy it when ‘politically down to earth’ people encounter something that they can’t explain – rather like those with ‘common sense’ when they encounter socialism for the first time.
For me the master of polemical music was Gil Scott Heron. Listen to his song Vildgolia from the Bridges album to see what I mean.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DDxSDYbj9Zc
I recently sighted a UFO and asked on a neighborhood website if anyone else had seen it. The response was a mixture of comical indulgence and outright hostility. It suddenly occurred to me that many have had such sightings but choose not to speak about it for fear of the contemptuous response. As it turned out what I saw was the meteor that recently crashed into our planet and a lot of my ‘neighbours’ had to apologise for their contemptuous remarks. The whole episode reminded me of people’s response when they find out that I’m a socialist – pure contempt. The fear of the unknown is real and potent.
I wonder if these towns are also ‘sanctuaries for the newly born’ given the levels of poverty and widespread lack of medical insurance in the USA.
‘The defeat of the English Revolution, for those not interested in history, society, philosophy… politics.’
Now LBird is venturing into history with, it seems, an equally fragile hold on the facts. How was the English Revolution defeated? As he himself states bourgeois ideology had triumphed as did their ‘New Model Army’. The Restoration was only possible with the consent of the capitalists and the concessions of the king. The attempted counter revolution in 1688 was totally crushed. Explain yourself master Bird.
‘Quite so, but that truism isn’t exclusively applicable to LBird…’
In its way that is also a truism since all ideologies are founded on an ignorance of the class struggle – but perhaps that’s what you meant Z?
‘You are a thoroughgoing idealist determinist and have shown this over and over again, despite paying spurious lipservice to Marxism’
Exactly robbo – I have believed this from the start. It is curious that many intelligent people (like our feathered friend) have no insight into their own ideological motivation and perspective.
