TrueScotsman
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“Taking advantage of what amounted to insurrections, Russian troops entered Crimea and also the Donbas.”
As usual All-in with whatever the fuck propaganda narrative NATOstani MSM throws at you you are entirely wrong. Russia already had troops in Crimea at the Sevastopol naval base. Zero Russian troops entered Donbass. A great deal of the Ukrainian army changed sides though and fought for the Donbass republics with the weapons, both heavy and light, they’d taken with them.
“The International Court of Justice has held “the right of every state to conduct its affairs without outside interference”
Indeed, and yet that didn’t stop NATOstan from interfering.
“and that an alleged right of intervention could not find a place in international law.””
Well, that’s simply not true as their is a right to pre-emptive self defence. If you’re coming over to my house with a loaded gun waving in the air saying how you’re going to shoot me I’m well within my rights to plug you before you walk up my driveway.
“One of our goals in the SPGB is the abolition of the nation-state. We don’t recognise that countries are natural entities but artificial creations. That is why we accept the re-drawing of any border to avoid war.”
That is what all Marxists aspire to but you are not Marxists. You are Utopian idealists. You inhabit a fantasy world located in your belly buttons. It’s why are so ineffectual and will forever remain so.
“I very much doubt you ever read what we wrote 2014 but it has remained consistent and here is a reminder.”
No thanks. You are informed by the NATOstani psyops and grandiose delusions of spontaneous revolutions. You’re analysis is crap.
““Yanukovych, faced with the alarming prospect of the severance of East Ukraine’s economic ties with Russia, announced that he would not sign the agreement with the EU after all. Thereby he set off the Orange protests and the current crisis.”
And what of the 5 billion dollars the US funneled in to the country to foment color revolution? That played no role? You see, your analysis is crap. Give you a join the dots picture of an elephant and you’d end up with an apple. You have no understanding of geopolitics whatsoever.
“This time, it seems, Ukraine has to make a definite choice. It cannot move toward membership in both the EU and the EAEC. That is unacceptable to both organizations. Ukraine would become the gap through which Russian or Kazakh goods (say) could enter the EU or German or Polish goods enter the EAEC, effectively turning Europe and the post-Soviet region into a single customs union.””
Russia didn’t give a crap about the EU, it was concerned with NATOstani encroachment and the slaughter of ethnic Russians on its border.
““Those… who seek to justify Russian action to a greater or lesser extent resort to the largely ad-hominem argument of guilt by association. If you don’t lend support, even qualified support, to Russia then you are, by default, somehow supporting NATO. This remains so even if you condemn both sides.
NATO is the imperialist tool of the world hegemon, the USA, so those who resist it are by definition anti-imperialist and require understanding at least, not condemnation, or so goes the argument. Those who position themselves on the left, but condemn Russia, are supposedly social-imperialists.
Taking an active pro-Ukraine stance against Russian aggression is to become a perhaps unwary ally of a virulent nationalism…””I think this is all about daddy issues for you lot. You got spanked too much as a child and now rebel against all authority. You’re are living examples of zlenin’s infantile disorder. You understand nothing in a profound way.
“TS argues that there can be a just war.”
I do. Fighting Nazism is just.
“In the case of Ukraine, Putin conducted a humanitarian invasion and a war of national defence.”
Yes.
“It was a pre-emptive war built upon Putin’s speculation of the imagined grounds that Ukraine was an existential threat to LPR and DPR and to Russia itself from NATO eastward expansion.”
You are editorialising Alli-in with the CIA. All-in thinks that because the Guardian didn’t write about Ukraine’s troop build up and imminent invasion of the Donbass that no such thing was about to happen. Following this smooth brained ligic D-day never happened either because the Times of London never reported on the invasion plans.
“Perceived threats by Putin as no actual invasion of the separatist republics had taken place and no NATO bases had been created on Ukrainian territory.”
Ukraine invaded the republics in 2014.
“Why was not the Baltic states’ earlier actual membership seen as even a bigger threat as it created a corridor to Russia’s second city St Petersburg?”
It is a threat and it may well be dealt with. But Nazis aren’t slaughtering Russian speaking civilians on a daily basis in those countries.
“Grounds also now exist for the invasion of Finland once it formally enters NATO. Will it happen?”
Possibly if NATO bases are built there, certainly if missile silos are.
“The claim of genocide can either be 6400 DPR-LPR dead, the majority killed several years previously and the majority being armed militia rather than civilians. OCHR’s estimate is 3,106 civilian deaths (7,000–9,000 wounded) on BOTH sides of the ceasefire lines.
Or was it the cultural UN definition of genocide, the extinction of Russian (and Hungarian) languages?”
Had the Ukrainian Nazi invasion not been disrupted by Russia’s entry in to the conflict: both.
“TS has avoided connecting the war with Ukraine’s imminent membership of the EU, although it was the trigger for the Maidan protests back in 2014.”
Didn’t talk about the price of tea in China either. Not relevant.
“TW appears (not for the first time) to be confused. On the one side he has frequently said he supports the Chinese regime, a regime that has said that Sovereignty should be upheld, yet on the other hand he supports the frontier change that Putin is trying to impose by force.”
Sovereignty should be upheld unless it is Nazi sovereignty. Russia is putting an end to the threat of NATOstani/Nazi violence. The more long range weapons the Nazis have the further they’re pushed back from
Russia’s borders. It’s a very simple equation. Nothing confusing about it at all.“Let’s not forget that the reasons that Putin start of this was the “mistreatment” of ethnic Russians in The Ukraine and the possible expansion of the EU and or NATO.”
That is true.
“The speech below was made BEFORE the Crimean/Donbas occupation, it shows that the aim was border change from the very beginning”
No, that is merely your mistaken interpretation of the speech.
“not a resolution that solved these “problems” in any other way.”
I beg to differ. The destruction of the NATOstani/Nazi puppet government in Kiev will solve at least one problem. The Nazi problem.
“I am determined to solve (1) the Ukrainian question and (2) to see to it that a change is made in the relationship between Russia and The Ukraine that shall ensure a peaceful co-existence. In this I am resolved to continue to fight until either the present Ukrainian government is willing to continue to bring about this frontier change or until another Ukrainian Government is ready to do so.”
“Frontier change” obviously means a change from threats on Russia’s border to non-threats on
Russia’s border.“I am resolved to remove from Russian frontiers the element of uncertainty, the everlasting atmosphere of conditions resembling civil war. I will see to it that in the West there is, on the frontier, a peace precisely similar to that on our other frontiers.””
And there you have it. Plain as day.
“So what is it, TW do you support the aim of frontier change”
A peaceful border?
“as it was outlined above?”
What is your problem with peace?
“In the light of the recent China, is the pre war statement still a reasonable one that you are happy about?”
Peace is reasonable, yes.
“It’s a straightforward question, are you happy with the ideas that were put forward in the speech, or do you not?”
I am. I am for good things and against bad things.
“So you’re happy to support what Putin said in 2021, despite what the Chinese are saying right now! When the Chinese are clearly saying that sovereignty should be upheld?????”
And what makes you think the Chinese don’t have a similar view on Ukraine’s lack of sovereignty?
“But surely your “Marxist” heroes have stated that “sovereignty of all countries should be upheld”.”
Ukraine has had no sovereignty since the US engineered a Nazi coup. It is a NATOStan puppet statelet.
“Simply because there is no convincing evidence of what you describe as a probable “catastrophic” Ukrainian defeat.”
There’s plenty. Closing your eyes to it doesn’t make it go away.
“I have still to get an answer from our resident Putin bootlicker regarding what proportion of the Ukrainian population does he consider to be Nazis 5%? 20% 70% What? It is curious that he is so reluctant to address this question. I wonder why….”
What percentage of Germans were Nazis? And what does it even matter? If you’re fighting for a Nazi state you are as guilty as the criminals ordering you to battle.
A surprisingly good article on Counterpunch assigning blame for the conflict on where it belongs. The USA.
“It’s enough to make a cat laugh. There are 100 minority languages in Russia…”
“Foreign” means foreign, non-national, therefore not a language spoken by any of Russia’s ethnicities, like English or French.
It’s not about banning foreign language, it’s about banning “foreign” words from official documents when there is Russian equivalent.
You’re avoiding my questions All-in Guardian Brah. Why do you consistently pass off as news NATOstani state media narratives while ignoring the evidence of a catastrophic Ukrainian defeat in the making? Your “party” is too ineffectual to be an MI6 op. Are you just sincerely credulous of everything you hear in the MSM? It’s so bizarre.
” Russian military reporter “Rybar”, who said Russian possession of the E40 and T0504 did not constitute operational encirclement.
“Thanks to the network of branched ring roads in the fields between the main routes, Ukrainian formations almost unhindered transfer reinforcements to the crucible of the Bakhmut meat grinder,” Rybar wrote.”All-in with the MI6 even you must now see the writing on the wall. Bakhmut is about to fall. The Ukrainians have nothing but fields and maybe a country lane or two to flee by. It’s all but over for the troops there unless they evacuate now. Kiev ordered their Nazis in Mariupol to stay put and become encircled. Will they do similarly now. We’ll soon find out.
“Rybar also belied the claim that the E40 was taken or even under Russian fire control. He said Ukraine was preparing to tactically withdraw from Paraskoviivka in order to make a firmer stand at neighbouring Berkhovka, a way station on the E40 highway through which it was still able to supply Bakhmut with ammunition.”
Maybe he’s right, maybe he’s wrong but either way, and as I’ve been saying, Bakhmut is soon to fall to the Russians.
“Prigozhin confirmed the Ukrainian resupply of men and ammunition.”
He is well known for delaying big news. Perhaps he’s doing so again?
“My thinking is that Ukraine can lose control of Bahkmut but it still won’t make it a great strategic advance.”
It means the collapse of Ukraine’s main defence line in Donbass. You’re obviously not very good at reading maps.
”6 months to do it…how many months to take Kramatorsk?”
Lol. And what’s happened in the meantime? Oh, that’s right… Russia has mobilised 380,000 more men and Ukraine has run out of tanks and artillery shells. I’m sure that won’t make any difference at all on the battlefield. I’m very curious All- in with the deep state. You claim to have no dog in this fight and to be a materialist and yet you endlessly parrot NATO state media and ignore all evidence Ukraine is losing catastrophically. Why is that?
“In fact, vast swathes of the Donets-Luhansk area could be captured but it won’t lead to Ukraine’s capitulation or Russian victory.”
What are Russia’s war aims All-in with NATOstan and how will you judge whether or not they’ve achieved those aims?
“I stick with the scenario that it will be a protracted prolonged war as I do6 months to do it…how many months to take Kramatorsk?”
Donbass free by August. Not far off.
“In fact, vast swathes of the Donets-Luhansk area could be captured but it won’t lead to Ukraine’s capitulation or Russian victory.”
And when the whole of the Donbass is captured in August as Ritter estimates? Then what?
“I stick with the scenario that it will be a protracted prolonged war as I don’t see much movement towards any ceasefire armistice.”
Ritter thinks Moscow will give Kiev one last chance to negotiate after Donbass is taken. If the offer is refused, it’ll be all the way to the Polish border.
“Most everybody in the imperialist west, having been subjected to years of neo-con brainworms, regard Putin’s view as utterly delusional.”
There, fixed it for you. Funnily enough, the rest of the world’s population, you know, most of it, think Russia’s actions justifiable.
“Russia’s alleged isolation is a delusion, because in reality it enjoys the support of two-thirds of the world’s population”
I guess all those dirty brown and yellow people are “delusional” too. Kinda racist, no? Lol
“A road from Chasiv Var is still re-supplying Ukrainian forces”
Even MSM is starting to report the truth.
“Donetsk officials…Moscow’s forces were in control of “all” access roads to Bakhmut, including the local T0504, which runs into the city from the west.”
