Lizzie45
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The prosecution of Trump on the charge that he attempted to overturn the results of the 2020 election is a clear case where democratic principles are alive. It was after all a jury of twenty or so ordinary citizens (read: workers) that indicted him. What’s undemocratic about that?
Well said!
In the meantime, Trump and his allies have been indicted in Georgia over the attempt to reverse the 2020 election results
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/aug/14/donald-trump-georgia-indictment-2020-election
But’s it’s all a dastardly ploy of course!
If you could do that, I’d be grateful. If it was too much chew for you, I would also understand.
I’m happy to do that BD, but I’d much prefer you contact Phyllis in the first instance – I’m sure you must have her contact details.
BTW, I doubt you’ll be disappointed with the contents of the pamphlet!
“In a pamphlet entitled Socialism and Law the late Pieter Lawrence argues that the above article, which appeared in the November 2000 edition of the Socialist Standard, does not state the socialist position on law but rather an anarchist utopian position.”
I’m presuming you’re talking about this:
https://www.marxists.org/archive/lawrence/2006/6socialism_law.htmNo, not that one. The pamphlet I’m referring to doesn’t appear to be available online. Quite fortuitously I came into possession of a hard copy to which this link refers.
My point was that recourse to the law, rather than an appeal to voters, to deal with opponents was a new step in US politics, a further widening of the already wide “democratic deficit” there.
Voters are not in any position to cast judgement in criminal cases – that function rightly resides with the law courts.
The SPGB, however, takes an entirely different view.
Fortunately not every SPGB’er shares this outlook. In a pamphlet entitled Socialism and Law the late Pieter Lawrence argues that the above article, which appeared in the November 2000 edition of the Socialist Standard, does not state the socialist position on law but rather an anarchist utopian position. He went on to claim that it is in direct conflict with the socialist object and principles and is highly damaging to the socialist movement.
”The new trend is to remove political opponents thru the legal system.”
Seems to have spread to North America too.
So all the criminal charges against Trump have been ‘trumped-up’?
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-61084161
I thought you people eschewed conspiracy theories.
O Christ no. Not poetry. The music videos are bad enough.
Absolutely, especially the ones emanating from OZ 🙂 🙂 🙂
Never thought I’d agree with you, Essex Boy!
Lizzie45, at times you can be very cynical, pedantic, provocative and argumentative, are you absolutely sure you are not a member of the SPGB?
Yup, quite sure, Marra! 🙂
Ok forget the Russia comparison (but see below) but you don’t see any parallel with the treatment of Lula and Rousseff in Brazil?
We’re talking here explicitly about Biden and the U.S.
You’ll be shouting ‘Fake News’ and sporting a MAGA baseball cap next! 🙂
In any event, leaving aside the charges of sexual and financial irregularities, to charge someone with refusing to accept the result of an election is a political and politically-motivated charge.
Trump’s not been charged with refusing to accept the result of an election but for his attempts to overturn an election.
He pursued an unprecedented campaign to overturn the 2020 election with support and assistance from his campaign, proxies, political allies, and many of his supporters. These efforts culminated in the January 6 Capitol attack by Trump supporters.
Trump and his allies used the big lie propaganda technique to promote numerous false claims and conspiracy theories asserting that the election was stolen by means of rigged voting machines, electoral fraud and an international communist conspiracy.
Trump pressed Justice Department leaders to challenge the election results and publicly state the election was corrupt. However, the U.S. attorney general, the director of National Intelligence, and the director of the Cybersecurity and Infrastructure Security Agency – as well as some Trump campaign staff – dismissed these claims. State and federal judges, election officials, and state governors also decided the claims were baseless.
Trump and his allies encouraged state officials to throw out legally cast ballots, challenge vote-certification processes, and overturn certified election results. In an early January 2021 phone call, he pressed the Georgia secretary of state to find the 11,780 votes needed to secure his victory in the state. He repeatedly urged Georgia Governor Brian Kemp to convene a special session of the legislature to overturn Biden’s certified victory in the state, and he made a similar plea to the Pennsylvania Speaker of the House. On a conference call, he asked 300 Republican state legislators to seek ways to reverse certified election results in their states. Republican officials in seven states, directed by Trump’s personal attorney, created fraudulent electoral certificates of ascertainment to falsely assert Trump had been reelected.
It is these practices that overwhelmingly go against the principles of political democracy.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Attempts_to_overturn_the_2020_United_States_presidential_election
Is the Biden regime trying to do anything different?
Yes, there’s no comparison and it’s ridiculous to suggest otherwise.
The twice-impeached, now three times indicted ex-president’s appearance in a criminal court – his third since April – comes just days after a Washington DC grand jury charged him with three criminal conspiracies and obstruction in connection with his attempts to overturn the results of the 2020 presidential election.
In a poetic twist of fate, Trump’s latest arraignment brought him to the exact same courthouse where hundreds of people have already been tried, convicted and sentenced to terms in prison as long as 18 years for charges in connection with the events which occurred on January 6, 2021.
And that’s not counting all the other numerous charges and investigations, including the 37 charges related to his handling of classified documents, including national defence information, after leaving the White House.
We must get out from our little world and participate in other people forum otherwise we are going to spend our whole life debating among ourselves
It’s already happened matey. Almamater is debating with Almamater who in turn is debating with, let me see now……..oh, surprise surprise, it’s Almamater.
