Bijou Drains
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You say that people are reluctant to try a completely untried and untested alterative, but any progress in society has been untried and untested. This has not been a bar to progress in the past, why should it be a bar in the future.
As to the idea that what we are proposing is so alien to everything they have experienced in their lives thus far, I would dispute this. There are lots of evidence of people working together on a mutual basis for the benefit of others, trades union activiites, allotment societies, food banks, sports clubs, youth groups, volutary organisations, etc. etc.
Since the start of humanity, the whole human experience is one of people working together to work mutually for their own benefit (presumably with the singular exception of Keith Joseph)
Lizzie45 “Those changes were not the result of the conscious actions of the world’s population. How could they be? There were no means in place (videre licet, universal suffrage), to record the collective will, even in the extremely improbable likelihood one even existed.”
DJP – “You’ve made a silly slip up here. Something existing is not dependent on the possibility of it being recorded or measured. Obviously you know that.
But anyhow, a shift in the use of technology (BTW I can’t see how that can occur ‘unconsciously’, without people being aware of it), is different from a political shift in how a society organises itself. Technological determinism isn’t a useful way to understand politics.”
DJP, I don’t disagree with you, but actually Lizzy45 didn’t actually ask for an example of a “shift on how society organises itself” as DJP has referred to, she actually asked for an example “where the mode of production/way of life was changed by the conscious actions of the world’s population”. That was the question posed, it didn’t directly ask for an understanding of politics and it didn’t imply technological determinism, I merely answered the question she posed
Changes in the “mode of production/way of life” did undoubtedly take place during the development of the Bronze Age, the Iron Age and especially during the development of the agricultural revolution (aka the Neolithic revolution) i.e. the move from hunter gather to agricultural revolution, so I am correct in giving the answer I gave in this area. If Lizzy45 thinks that they were not conscious moves, this would mean that she thinks that these moves occurred in an unconscious way and I don’t think even Freud would make that kind of claim!
Is she claiming that groups of hunter gathers just went off to sleep one night and then woke up in a ploughed field saying “fuck me, we’re farmers, how the hell did that happen?”
So really, if Lizzie45 asks a stupid question, you can’t blame me for giving a stupid answer. Perhaps she should ask questions about astro physics, I believe she may have mentioned that she is an astro physicist (irony alert)
Lizzie45 – “Provide one example where the mode of production/way of life was changed by the conscious actions of the world’s population.”
Yes, the move from stone age production to bronze age manufacturing and then to Iron Age production were large scale changes in the mode of production/way of life. You could also use the agricultural revolution as an example.
Following that logic the human species would never have moved out of Africa. The whole history of human development (good and bad) is littered with examples of humans doing exactly the opposite to what you are suggesting.
I don’t know if this is a German/Austrian saying but it’s ironic if it is.
Keep trying to bend history to fit your views.
I’ve got to say that judging a planetary population of 7.5 billion people by the reactions of 2 people is a more than a little unscientific. Reich would be proud of you.
To be honest I very rarely watch the news for just the same reason. It doesn’t mean that I’m unaware of what’s going on, it is impossible to escape from it, what with radio news, twitter feeds, messaging, etc.
It doesn’t mean that I don’t recognise the need for change, no doubt many others feel the same way.
The problem is that we are “educated” to believe that if people all behave in a particular way, it’s because we’re all thinking the same things. People often behave in the same way for completely different reasons, something Reich could well have benefited from recognising
You might find FC Ball’s biography of Tressell “One of the Damned” very interesting.
Although, I believe, some of the information Ball put forward is disputed, it is a very interesting read.
There is also the biography of Tressell’s daughter, Tressell and the Late Kathleen: A Biographical Memoir and a Message of Hope, which adds even more information
When you’re playing poker you need to look confident, even if you’ve got a shit hand. The same goes for both sides.
Well, look at the bright side, at least you didn’t put a bet on the SPGB putting forward two candidates, one in Clapham and one in Folkstone and Hythe.
Don’t think the working class is dumbing down, but Tory MPs seem to be getting even thicker!
From what I understand (and am happy to be corrected) most of the mineral wealth is in the Eastern side of the Ukraine.
From Amazon – “Jon Key was born in Cambridge in 1974 where he grew up with his mother, father, and his brother Tim. He studied engineering at Cambridge University before spending his career in a number of executive and consultancy jobs with public and private companies before running his own company.
Along the way, Jon has taught English in China, took part in a round-the-world yacht race, and run in ten marathons. He has lived in Australia, Africa, Asia, Europe, and South America and travelled and worked across the world. He lives with his wife Ali and their four children in London.
Jon specialises in solving critical and complex challenges for CEOs and their leadership teams. Throughout his life, he has tried to learn from his own experiences and those of others and to apply the lessons every day to new situations, especially during the COVID-19 crisis.”
Interesting that despite being so important in the world and vital to all of us, business consultants were not included in the list of key workers needed to maintain society during the pandemic, I wonder why that was?
Anyway even if he specialises in solving “critical and complex challenges”, he’s going to have his hands full trying to sort out capitalism.
Funnily enough I was going to post about Sunak and his approach to being reelected. If he’s got even a slither of a chance to pull it off, he needs to start to appeal to younger voters and also to hold on to his higher rating in the older persons groups.
However he looks likely to have pissed off the youth with his National Service idea and also pissed off a large section of the over 85s by buggering off early from the D Day celebrations.
I was starting to wonder if he was deliberately screwing things up to get back at the Tory backbenchers who have making his life a misery. Let’s face it he can fly off to California with his squillions and have a grand old time.
Also was wondering if he’d thought through his National Service idea completely.
Northern Ireland has about 20,000 young people with Nationalist leanings, can’t think they’d be enamoured with the thought of marching about in a British Army uniform and I don’t think the security forces would be that keen to have 20,000 Nationalists trained to handle guns and munitions!
