Bijou Drains
Forum Replies Created
-
Posts
-
alanjjohnstone wrote:As for playing regularly into your forties, Tim, can i ask how many operations you have had on your knees and if you personally haven't, how many of your team-mates you know, did have ? So what about the social cost of some sports? How much health resources should be devoted to itQuote:Even if the majority disapprove, is it their right to stop the sport freely enjoyed by others if it harms no one but the participants?
. A nursing friend told me once that A/E was full of patients on the Sunday from the games played on the Saturday…hyped up and boozed up after the game the extent of their injuries didn't come apparent until after they sobered up and woke up next day
My knees are fine, despite the fact that I broke a leg on three occasions during my time playing football, perhaps it was the fact that I was lucky that the three broken legs were opponents legs not mine. To be fair, although I played the marority of games as a centre half, I was only ever booked once, and on the three occasions mentioned above each one was where an opponent was trying to "do" me.If we are going to use the social costs of sport to stop them taking place under socialism are we also going to do the same around alcohol, tobbacco, food consumption, unprotected sex, mountain climbing, canoeing, skin diving, etc. Is this ban goign to be imposed by the "Socialist Police" or are there just going to be disapproving looks from the enlightened.
Young Master Smeet wrote:There is a real question as to whether a member can be permantly banned from online party fora. Members here have experessed disagreement with placing members under moderation (which I do favour, and believe the EC or Moderators could do) since that allows members to express themselves still. But, realistically, if we're saying, as we would be wwere a member to be excluded from a party forum, that they cannot behave themselves sufficiently to do so, then really we should eb expelling that person from the party outright, not creating a second class member.If so, as per recent party discussions, the matter should be referred to the member's branch, and not the EC, per rule 29.Rule 29 wrote:29. Charges against any member shall be submitted in writing to the Branch and a copy supplied to the member accused who shall be allowed 14 days to enter the defence.if the branch declines to act, there may be a case for enacting rule 31
rule 31 wrote:The EC shall forthwith submit particulars of the charge to all Branches and at the same time communicate the charges in writing to the accused and enclose a copy of this rule. Branches shall hold at least one specially summoned meeting to discuss the charge. The Delegates at the next Delegate Meeting or Annual Conference shall hear the case of the EC and of the accused; after which no further circulation of arguments for or against the charge may take place. The Delegates shall submit their findings to a Party Poll and the result of the Party Poll shall apply as from the date of suspension. No parties to the charge or dispute shall be allowed to sit as Delegates or Chair at Conference, ADM or any EC meeting where the case is being reviewed.A permanent ban (or even a sustained ban) is a different kettle of fish to a temporary "go calm yourself down" ban.
I have got to say I fully agree with your analysis. A sine die exclusion from party fora, also has furhter implications when the person excluded is a Branch Secretary and when the Branch in question organises primarily through the party's internet presence! If we have an on line meeting of the Branch to discuss Cde Marratty's ban from the forum, how can cde Marratty be included in that discussion. In my opinion there has to be a way to resolve this dispute in a comradely and progressive way. It also to my mind highlights the need to examine how our internal democratic processes will need to adapt appropriately to the use of information technology.
I played local non league football in the Newcastle and district leagues until I was well into my forties, I'm not sure about sport or entertainment, but self harm probably fits the description quite well. Given a chance I'd be there again in a heart beat. A socialism without sport is unthinkable to me. A sport without commercial presides sounds like my idea of heaven. Even if the majority disapprove, is it their right to stop the sport freely enjoyed by others if it harms no one but the participants?The thread reminded me of one of the most bizarre incidents that happened at a football match. We had just played and narrowly beaten one of the biggest bunch of nutters in our league and their captain put his head through the door and told us "someone" had just smashed up one of our cars. The look on his face when we told him that we'd all come on the bus! They'd smashed up their own goalies car!
DJP wrote:alanjjohnstone wrote:Quote:It's up to them to develop their ideas.By implication then, the working class doesn't need a socialist party to educate, agitate and organise.
Well socialist ideas certainly do not originate with the SPGB, there's nothing that the SPGB says that others have not thought of independently. I think it's not a case of "making socialists" but of finding socialists, or arranging things so that socialists can find us.
If that is your view, you are within your right to work for socialism in whatever way you choose, what I find odd is that you seem to find it hard to recognise that others want to carry out different kind of activities and appear to be intent on blocking or criticising them for doing so. If you want to sit in your ivory tower, like some Victorian maiden spraying the kind of perfume on that you think will attract the working class to you, off you go, but please have the courtesy to respect others who want to do it differently.
LBird wrote:alanjjohnstone quote wrote:…“proof” … is rife with the selection and manipulation of facts to fit a desired conclusion…I've been saying for years here that this is 'the scientific method'.The sooner we accept that this is 'science', and begin by presuming that revealing one's own 'desired conclusion' (ie. one's ideological starting point) is the correct method, the better for science.As I've said before, regarding this thread's content, start from 'peace-bands' and 'war-bands' (for example), and the 'proof' will flow.This is how all science works, including physics.The 'disinterested scientist' with a 'neutral method' to produce 'objective Truth' is itself a ruling class idea, a bourgeois myth.Hello, alan.
Nurse, Nurse, he's out of bed again!!!!
DJP wrote:Tim Kilgallon wrote:A comrade comes up with an ideaIdeas are very easy to come up with, especially if they are for other people to do. The problem is getting them put into action. If anyone wants to go to France then great! But who? And what effect could we realistically expect it to have?Normally it's Alan that is Private Fraser, so glad to be the fill in.
well to be honest Comrade, if this movement (theirs not ours) is still ongoing in the summer (when I finally get some time off from work) and there are other Comrades whose French is better than my schoolboy attempts at the language, I would probably be able to get across."If anyone wants to go to France then great" Obviously knowing we woould have your approval would be the icing on the cake.As to what effect we could realistically expect to have, well I guess it is more likely to produce results than sitting on the internet discussing how many angels can dance on a pin head with L Bird.
DJP wrote:alanjjohnstone wrote:Quote:Without a platform, program or organisation this will be going nowhere fast (or slowly).So we should try and fill that vacuum, don't you think.
It's up to them to develop their ideas. We could get someone to turn up with some leaflets but we wouldn't be treated like the messiah arriving and would likely have little real influence on the movement. People are, rightly, suspicious of being manipulated by political parties…
And we wonder why we have difficulty recruiting. A comrade comes up with an idea for some positive action and the way forward is to pour cold water with a liberal helping of doom and gloom on it. Have we been the victim of some kind of bizarre entryism from The Socialist Studies/Ashbourne Court Group, with the intent of taking the "slogan boring from within" to its logical conclusion.So instead of approaching members of the working class with ideas about class, production, society and politics with a view to explaining to them our political perspective and attempt to "make socialists" we should just sit in 52 Clapham High Street waiting for the working class to show up, watching Comrade Cheeryarse (DJP) hand in hand with Eyore and Private Frazer wander off into where the sunset would be if it wasn't so bloody gloomy.
alanjjohnstone wrote:No, while supporting a paid Gen Sec i don't think it will address a problem in that we have reached a position that we cannot do everything we would want to.i would seek the job description of Gen Sec and HOO being combined into one position for a half-decent wage and "above the shop" accommodation provided if required and not as a "job on the side". If so i might just apply myself when i am obliged to return to the UK ;-pSimply look at the attendance of branch meetings…many are barely meeting quorum numbers… …and that includes the London branches which were once the core of the Party in past years. The demographics are clear on the future trend of the Party and it is not promising, TimI think it would be more appropriate to seek out someone who is currently working for themselves doing self employed admin/secretarial work, getting them to do their work, which in my experience is a highly skilled and very complicated task and then paying them their rate for the job, in the same way that we would pay a builder if we needed some building done, or a plasterer if we needed some plastering done.As to the demographics, unless we stopping concentrating on running the admin of the party and start concentrating on building the party we shall die, the fact that we shall die with considerable wealth is of no comfort to me.
Which is precisely why I shall be voting for the motion put forward by Yorkshire regional branch re paying a General Secretary. If we have a paid General Secretary carrying out the routine, but non political tasks, this should release tie from those voluntarily doing these tasks to do the political style stuff like this.
Surely the answer is to get a few comrades who want to go over, get a whole load of stuff from HO and go over and do it.Do we need to have an endorsed campaign by the EC for everything we do, surely not.In terms of costs, if those who wanted to go over put an appeal on here for some funds in the short term with an application for a retrospective application for funding from the EC, I'm sure funding would be made available.
Young Master Smeet wrote:Well, in essence, that's what the Labour Party did back in '45, they took out huge loans (or, rather, they converted shares into debt, which they paid interest instead of dividends).yes but if we get a loan from Wonga we can just tell them to F+@! off when they ask for their money back, everyone else does.
