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LBird wrote:

Tim Kilgallon wrote:

with all due respect, L Bird, I asked what your opinion is, not Jordan's. So again, what is your opinion, of Marx's view of where humans came from if the world is their divine creation?

With all due respect, Tim, you'll have to read what I've already said to YMS, here on this thread, which was already a repetition of what I've said many times.The mod has already given a warning about saying the same thing, over and over, so I'm taking heed.

With all due respect, L Bird, I think you are unprepared to answer a straight question. I don't think for one moment that the Mods will sanction you for giving a straight answer, or that your reluctance to answer is in anyway linked to your concern that the Mods may intervene. I very much doubt that any other reader of this thread thinks your reluctance to answer is due to anything other than the fact that the answer you would be forced to give, is as ludicrous as you are.I think, my little Liver Bird, that you are just like the River Mersey you overlook. A big mouth and full of shit.

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LBird wrote:

Tim Kilgallon wrote:

LBird wrote:

Young Master Smeet wrote:

LBird wrote:

Marx regarded humans as divine creators.

JUst one question: where do humans come from, if the world is their divine creation?

You'll have to take that up with Marx, YMS.Or, perhaps, actually read Jordan's text.

To rephrase YMS's question, where (in your opinion) did Marx think humans come from if he thought that the world was their divine creation?

 with all due respect, L Bird, I asked what your opinion is, not Jordan's. So again, what is your opinion, of Marx's view of where humans came from if the world is their divine creation?Jordan, section 4 Sacred and Profane History (in book, pp. 34-7).

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LBird wrote:

Young Master Smeet wrote:

LBird wrote:

Marx regarded humans as divine creators.

JUst one question: where do humans come from, if the world is their divine creation?

You'll have to take that up with Marx, YMS.Or, perhaps, actually read Jordan's text.

To rephrase YMS's question, where (in your opinion) did Marx think humans come from if he thought that the world was their divine creation?

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LBird wrote:

Tim Kilgallon wrote:

… but I beg you indulge the fool.

Since you've been so humble and honest, who I am to refuse?

The Fool wrote:

Can you (answering simply yes or no) let us know if, in all of the time you have been putting forward your cockamammie idea that the whole world population should vote on every "scientific truth"…

You're wrong again here, Fool, because you're following robbo's 'cockamammie idea' about 'social production', not mine (or Marx's). You'll have to take up your question with robbo, because it's not up to me to answer for robbo's 'ideas', 'cockamammie' or not.Now, if you want to discuss Jordan's opinions about Marx, I'll continue the dialogue. But if you want to discuss robbo's opinions, then please go to robbo's new thread. I won't reply here to any more 'foolish' queries.

I'll take that as a no then, should I?

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LBird wrote:

Tim Kilgallon wrote:

LBird wrote:

 this problem goes deeper than me simply being an argumentative bastard. 

There is an alternative explanation, another feasible reason why everyone disagrees with you, can you guess what it is?

Fools like you, masquerading as 'socialists'?

Hmmm, perhaps not the reply I was looking for, but definitely the reply that could have been predicited.Let me put it another way.Judging from your comments about your contact with other political parties, you quite clearly have been in contact with lots of different individuals over many, many years, putting forward your viewpoints and ideas. It might be fair to assume that these individuals had at least a passing interest in your viewpoint and at least a rudimentary interest in what you have to say. Can I then ask you a very straight question, I know you are not fond of answering yes or no questions, but I beg you indulge the fool. Can you (answering simply yes or no) let us know if, in all of the time you have been putting forward your cockamammie idea that the whole world population should vote on every "scientific truth", have you ever encountered a single individual who agrees with your proposition?

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LBird wrote:

 this problem goes deeper than me simply being an argumentative bastard. 

There is an alternative explanation, another feasible reason why everyone disagrees with you, can you guess what it is?

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DJP wrote:

Young Master Smeet wrote:

I believe the IWGB were behind the Uber court case, and I know they have organised outsourced Universiy of London cleaners.

The Uber case was to do with GMB. IWGB was to do with the Deliveroo strike. For a small union, the IWGB seems to be doing very well for themselves.

The IWGB have also organised the first union branch for Foster Carers and are rumoured to be taking a similar case to court re employment rights for foster carers. If that case is won it could have massive implications for 60,000 foster carers in the U.K. Perhaps we are witnessing a rebirth of trades unionism?

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On several occasions I have wandered up to the callow youths selling which ever Trotskyist rag is in fashion at the local universities and asked them about their view of the Cuban regime. The predictable response is the usual cut and paste collection of "heroic stand against US imperialism", "solidarity with the Cuban revolution", etc.When asked about the way Castro gave a hero's welcome to Ramon Mercader, they generally become a little bit confused, unsure about who I'm referring to.When it is explained that Ramon was the guy who restyled old Leon's fringe with an ice pick they generally become very confused.I had one of them (presumably one of the leading cadre) tell me I was "a liar, a fucking liar" and he then ran around in a frenzy telling the rest of "the comrades" that they couldn't speak to me and saying words to the effect that I was a counter-revolutionary tapeworm in the pay of the CIA. Strange buggers these Trotskyists 

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robbo203 wrote:

Thanks Dave ,  Thats a very useful start indeed.  If you have any other links you can post here that would be great, I guess the really tricky bit is to estimate the amount of  labour that is indirectly socially useless.  Banks for example are housed in buildings but we normally think of the construction industry as being socially useful,  In this instance part of the industry is devoted to provisioning a socially useless activity – banking.  The same argument applies to utilities and infrastructure Talking of the construction industry we should not overlook the truly monumental waste involved in empty homes.  In Europe there are 11 million empty homes (and 4 million homeless people). In America the figure is 18 million, In China it is a staggering 60 million.  And even this is only the tip of the iceberg.  It does not taking into account the numerous half completed projects (which are quite a common sight here in Spain) , not to mention all those empty offices shops, warehouses and factories  I think the figure of just over half the workforce being involved in socially useless labour is about right

Also: Sales and marketing staff, auditors, advertising industry, those manufacturing goods for use in the banking industry (cheque books, paper for bank statements, money, tbose irritating little fucking pens, etc.), management consultants, people involved in the education and training of all of the people mentioned above, people involved in the production of tickets, ticket machines, ticket barriers, bloody ticket inspectors, miners who dig gold out of a hole in South Africa, transport workers who transport it to another hole in the ground (Fort Worth and other bullion holding centre), armed guards watch the gold in its  new hole in the ground to make sure it stays there, the people who do exactly the same for diamonds, rubies, emeralds, etc. estate agents, all of the staff at the national lottery, charity fund raisers, job centre workers, people administering pensions and state benefits, tax officials, tax consultants, actors hawking their wares on TV ads cajoling us into buying the tawdry tat the supermarkets label as "special",  Noel friggin Edmonds, the royal family, the large number of people employed by the royal household ensuring the useless gits don't die from being unable to do the simplest tasks like making a meal for themselves, bookmakers, the gambling "industry", Alan  Bastard Sugar, everyone involved in the X factor, burglar alarm manufacturers and installers, PPI sales people, about 80% of the poor sods who work in call centres, bar staff (in socialism we'll put the pumps the other way round so you can help yourself), financial fraudsters, thieves… the list goes on and on.

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jondwhite wrote:

One of the most important original pamphlets the party ever produced was 'Socialism' and one of the editions (possibly from 1925) included an illustrated cover picturing a lady wearing a sash that read 'science'. A picture has just been published online herehttp://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/S-P-G-B-Socialism-Pamphlet-Socialist-Party-of-Great-Britain-c-1925-Socialist-/142184957266?hash=item211ae24552:g:ATAAAOSwHMJYMXQRhttp://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/ATAAAOSwHMJYMXQR/s-l1600.jpg

oh crap, don't mention science, you'll wake the L Bird up!!!(for those of you who don't know the L Bird is a semi mythical creature who lives in a strange land called Votopia.The L Bird is a very sensitive soul who has a unique reaction to the word science. When he hears that word he rises from his nest of half digested copies of the Works of Frederick Engels and gets himself into a right old lather, flapping his crusty old wings about, calling for votes on the existence of custard, saying that he and only he could decide what the future is going to look like and usually ending it all by everyone a Leninists and generally being a complete pain in the hoop.Thankfully the L Bird has been quietly brooding in his nest for a little while, he usually sits there dormant for a short period of time after all of the questions he refuses to answer have mounted up to the point where he feels a complete tool. But be careful, it doesn't take much for the L Bird to be wakened from his slumbers, take his beak out of his arse and start the whole process off again.strangely the L Bird seems to have some kind of magic amulet that protects him from the attentions of the legendary all powerful wizards called "The Mods"Round our way parents used to chide their children by telling them that if they didn't settle offf to sleep they'd summon up the L Bird who would send the off to the land of nod with one majestic sweep of his ludicrous ideas.)

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JamesH81 wrote:

 my mother is buying me this…. -Marxian Economics and Globalization (Oriya) Paperback – 2009 by Adam Buick (Author), Binay Sarkar (Author) https://www.amazon.co.uk/Marxian-Economics-Globalization-Adam-Buick/dp/819025295Xand….State Capitalism: The Wages System under New Management Paperback – 10 Oct 1986 by Adam Buick (Author), John Crump (Contributor) https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/0333367766/ref=wl_it_dp_o_pC_nS_ttl?_encoding=UTF8&colid=3J8P1VOEL30HJ&coliid=I1QVL2IDR1C8I3for my birthdayyours for socialismjames h 

happy birthday James. My old Mam bought me the 3 volumes of capital for my 21st Birthday. Good luck!YFSTim

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LBird wrote:

Tim Kilgallon wrote:

So tell me L Bird, in the "communist society" you propose, we have a world wide vote on a scientific theory. For arguments sake let's take the theory of what causes thunder.The vote are cast and the "truth" is decided along the lines of discharge of electrons between clouds, etc. However I'm still of the opinion that it's caused by a big guy in the sky with a hammer called Thor.What happens to me? Am I carted off to a idealist-materialist reeducation camp to ensure I acknowledge "the truth". Also how long do I have to wait before we can have another vote?

Tim, stay out of it – I can't take your inability to discuss sensibly. I'll only end up getting banned, because I'll talk to you like one talks to a dimwit, and I shouldn't treat you like that, so I won't reply to your stupidities any further.If you don't like it, complain to the mods.

Presumably a dimwit like me gets an equal vote on string theory to a genius like L Bird?

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LBird wrote:

Tim Kilgallon wrote:

So tell me L Bird, in the "communist society" you propose, we have a world wide vote on a scientific theory. For arguments sake let's take the theory of what causes thunder.The vote are cast and the "truth" is decided along the lines of discharge of electrons between clouds, etc. However I'm still of the opinion that it's caused by a big guy in the sky with a hammer called Thor.What happens to me? Am I carted off to a idealist-materialist reeducation camp to ensure I acknowledge "the truth". Also how long do I have to wait before we can have another vote?

Tim, stay out of it – I can't take your inability to discuss sensibly. I'll only end up getting banned, because I'll talk to you like one talks to a dimwit, and I shouldn't treat you like that, so I won't reply to your stupidities any further.If you don't like it, complain to the mods.

I take it you think I'm too stupid to take part in this conversation and I should leave it to an elite, such as L Bird to take part in the debate. Who's the Leninist now. With your narcissistic retort, me thinks your chronic low self esteem is starting to show itself.Alternatively you could just answer the question.

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So tell me L Bird, in the "communist society" you propose, we have a world wide vote on a scientific theory. For arguments sake let's take the theory of what causes thunder.The vote are cast and the "truth" is decided along the lines of discharge of electrons between clouds, etc. However I'm still of the opinion that it's caused by a big guy in the sky with a hammer called Thor.What happens to me? Am I carted off to a idealist-materialist reeducation camp to ensure I acknowledge "the truth". Also how long do I have to wait before we can have another vote?

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Steve-SanFrancisco-UserExperienceResearchSpecialist wrote:

I don't know where this goes, but I have an algorythim to legally win any election you want.  It's a bit of social engineering with a digital currenty solution to motivating supporters, that I discovered as a corrallary to my Unviersal Values Exchange System Protocols that I've been working on as a method of relacing money with something more perfect that could serve communism better than the capital goods based dollar.  Anyway, here's a tweet that would have given us bernie sanders for president if only it had been tweeted 6 months before the democratic primary.  this one tweet has the ability to exponentially multiply supporter turnout and engagement.  as well as covert undecided and even opositional views to the cause of Bernie Sanders.  Um, it would also work for republicans or democrats or socialist who want to win an election.  So Here's a peek at how I could have won the election for Bernier Sanders as president, if only I'd thought of it sooner.   

Quote:

I will give 1 hour of my time to anyone who votes.  Just send me a photo of your ballot stubs as proof.  You can vote any way you want and you can’t tell me how you vote.  I’m just rewarding you for your efforts to vote because I want you to vote and I want to prove it with an hour of my time.  Tell me what you want me to do for 1 hour and I’ll upload photo proof that I did what you asked.  See my public history and comments and ratings for my past 1 hour promises to others.  They’ve asked me to do some strange things with my 1 hour like quack like a duck while reading marx on a video cam channel, but whatever you want is cool with me.  I’d like to spend an hour planting a tree to picking up letter in a park if it’s nearby or something that helps the public good.   Tweet your photo and request to  #Bernie.coin.time.value.exchange.offer.133215342  I’ll reply with a link and estimated completion time for your 1 hour hour and you can come back and check the status and see how many favors I’ve done lately and how far you are in the list.  Also, I might trade my 1 hour favor with others who owe me time favors too, if that gets it done for you faster.  If you’re nearby one of my friends I could do some grocery shopping for you or something like that.  If you vote on the best 1 hour favor someone ask me to do you can win prizes and more hours of me doing whatever you want (within reason). For legal tax and voting law reasons there can be no exchange of property of monetary value, so don’t ask for money or ask me to write you a check or make any commitments with my 1 hour of service to you.  Public Notice: This exchange offer is valid only for registered democrats or independents.  Additionally, to qualify you must have at least 1 tweet in your twitter history favorable to Bernie Sanders and include a link to it.   (this is legal a way to prove that they likely voted for Bernie Sanders in the Primary). In your tweet, you must state your voter registration, link to your Bernie tweet, and a photo of your ballot entry for your entry into our contest to be valid.   

p.s. sorry if this is off topic. I'm not sure where something general and revolutionary would best fit in your discussions choices.  Please let me know where I should post this sort of information on your Board if this is the wrong place.  Sorry for the inconvenience I'm giving mods permission to move this for me in advance and my thanks for a PM telling me where they move it too. 

The price of LSD must have hit an all time low in San Francisco following Trump's election 

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