alanjjohnstone
Forum Replies Created
-
Posts
-
Germany said that it can’t stop a shipment of Russian uranium destined for French nuclear plants from being processed at a site in Germany because atomic fuel isn’t covered by European Union sanctions on Russia.
“We have no legal grounds to prevent the transport of uranium from Russia, because the sanctions imposed by the EU due to the Russian invasion of Ukraine exempt the import of nuclear fuel … to the EU from import bans,” said a spokesman for Germany’s Environment Ministry, Andreas Kuebler.
Hotels to make a mint
Will be the same at the coronation
I explained the constitutional position of the Polish government that refute’s Furr’s case that there was not a government.
It was 17 September 1939 when Mościcki, who was then in the small town of Kuty (now Ukraine) near the southern Polish border, issued a proclamation about his plan to transfer power to appoint Władysław Raczkiewicz as his successor. That was the day USSR invade.
The USSR invaded from the east during the early hours of 17 September. During the late hours of that day, the Polish government crossed the Polish–Romanian border.120,000 Polish troops withdrew to neutral Romania and Hungary and the majority of those formed Polish Armed Forces in the West in France and the United Kingdom. Roumania escorted the Polish gold reserves to safeguard it from interception by the Soviet Union.
The Polish strategy of continuing the war is explained here but the USSR invasion thwarted it.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Romanian_Bridgehead
It was the legitimate government and the USSR acknowledged it in 1941 when Barbarossa happened.
You suggest that Poland’s government should have relocated to the USSR. How did that pan out?
No point in continuing your revisionist history conspiracy. The Katyn Massacre was perpetuated by the Soviets. The documents are there and accepted as genuine by scholars and more importantly the Russian government. Furr is an out-lier and most likely an outright liar. He is pseudo-historian cherry-picking his evidence to prove a hypothesis instead of following evidence to develop one.
The CPGB was following the instructions of Comintern in being anti-war at first. Actually, it was pro-war initially but reversed its position to anti-war when told by Comintern.
“Should the Soviet Union have allowed the Nazis to occupy the entirety of former Polish territory? Yes or no?”
My answer is the same as if Germany had invaded Britain. It is the same as I have for the Ukrainians facing occupation by Russia which I have already stated. The answer is yes. 20 million lives were lost. There are many ways of resisting oppression by civil disobedience when there is a determined opposition. Thomas More has already mentioned Denmark’s response where Jews went unmolested and did not need to wear the yellow star.
No point in referring to GPO and the Holocaust and other secret plans as justification for the war. Those were not the motives but the consequences of it.
The Nazis managed to maintain control with the propaganda line that it was a war of defence, just as all other belligerent nations do.
I remind you of Goering’s comment
“Why of course the people don’t want war. Why should some poor slob on a farm want to risk his life in a war when the best he can get out of it is to come back to his farm in one piece? Naturally the common people don’t want war neither in Russia, nor in England, nor for that matter in Germany. That is understood. But, after all, it is the leaders of the country who determine the policy and it is always a simple matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy, or a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship.
Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the peacemakers for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country.”If the enemy does not fight, Goebbels would not have been able to convince Germany to make war.
Bijou, TS really should stand for Tedious Stalinist
He may enjoy this Hymn to Stalin
“…Thank you, Stalin. Thank you because I am joyful. Thank you because I am well. No matter how old I become, I shall never forget how we received Stalin two days ago. Centuries will pass, and the generations still to come will regard us as the happiest of mortals, as the most fortunate of men, because we lived in the century of centuries, because we were privileged to see Stalin, our inspired leader. Yes, and we regard ourselves as the happiest of mortals because we are the contemporaries of a man who never had an equal in world history.
The men of all ages will call on thy name, which is strong, beautiful, wise and marvelous. Thy name is engraven on every factory, every machine, every place on the earth, and in the hearts of all men.
Every time I have found myself in his presence I have been subjugated by his strength, his charm, his grandeur. I have experienced a great desire to sing, to cry out, to shout with joy and happiness. And now see me–me!–on the same platform where the Great Stalin stood a year ago. In what country, in what part of the world could such a thing happen.
I write books. I am an author. All thanks to thee, O great educator, Stalin. I love a young woman with a renewed love and shall perpetuate myself in my children–all thanks to thee, great educator, Stalin. I shall be eternally happy and joyous, all thanks to thee, great educator, Stalin. Everything belongs to thee, chief of our great country. And when the woman I love presents me with a child the first word it shall utter will be: Stalin.
O great Stalin, O leader of the peoples,
Thou who broughtest man to birth.
Thou who fructifies the earth,
Thou who restorest to centuries,
Thou who makest bloom the spring,
Thou who makest vibrate the musical chords…
Thou, splendour of my spring, O thou,
Sun reflected by millions of hearts.A. O.Avidenko
No doubt it will be described as a CIA front but this Rational Wiki is a useful description of what we are facing.
https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Stalin_apologetics
“But my question was why did the Communist Party oppose the war from 1939 – 1941 when several European nations had been attacked, invaded and occupied.”
TS responds “Why should the Soviets have gone to their rescue?”
Perhaps I did not make myself clear. I was referring to the CPGB, not the Soviet Union.
Until 1941, the CPGB took a very similar anti-war position as the SPGB of opposing a war against the Nazis.
(as an aside on a personal note, co-worker of mine’s father was put in jail as a CO for following the Party-line of the CP)An imperialist war suddenly transformed into a Great Patriotic Anti-Nazi war in 1941.
The non-existence of the Polish government.
Indeed the Polish government did flee to Romania, when USSR invaded and it became a 2-front war. Up to then, Poland’s government was still operating and its armed forces were still fighting until 6 Oct. In Romania it was interned stopping any government function.
On September 30, Ignacy Mościcki, President of Poland who was interned in Rumania, handed over his Office to Władysław Raczkiewicz, who managed to get to France.
This was done in accordance with art.24 of the Polish Constitution of 1935 which states that in time of war the term of the President’s office shall be prolonged to three months after the conclusion of peace and that the President by a special act appoints his successor in case the office falls vacant before the conclusion of peace. Art.24 thus preserves the continuity of the office of the President of the Republic of Poland, the source of constitutional authority and the continuity of successive Polish governments. The President is the Head of State. The President is the embodiment of sovereignty and continuity of State authority.
The Parliament of the Republic of Poland was dissolved by President Raczkiewicz in Paris, in November 1939. In its place, a National Council was formed, as an advisory body to the President.
On October 1 in Paris, a Government in Exile, with Sikorski as prime minister is sworn in and the United States and France officially recognised the government.
Generalplan Ost was a top-secret plan and not known to the Soviets.
“It was a strictly confidential document, and its contents were known only to those in the topmost level of the Nazi hierarchy.”
https://archive.ph/20120527021449/http://www.dac.neu.edu/holocaust/Hitlers_Plans.htm#selection-1253.91-1283.11The war was one of self-defence to maintain Soviet sovereignty. The very same reason given by the Ukrainian government.
And in the propaganda war both sides allege genocide intentions of the other.
As for the Polish interpretation of the proposed Anglo-French-Soviet pact, the condition of the right of occupation of Polish (and Romanian) territory was viewed as the reason Poland rejected it and neither Paris nor London could reassure Polish concerns. They were confirmed when Soviet forces invaded Poland and partitioned it with Germany.
The Soviet Union annexed 52.1% of Poland’s territory, with over 13,700,000 people: 38% Poles (ca. 5.1 million people), 37% Ukrainians, 14.5% Belarusians, 8.4% Jews, 0.9% Russians and 0.6% Germans.
The number of Poles deported to Siberia or Central Asia between 1939 and 1941 has been estimated at from under 500,000 to over 1,500,000
Between 1939 and the beginning of Operation Barbarossa approximately 500,000 Ukrainians would be deported to Siberia and central Asia.
But my question was why did the Communist Party oppose the war from 1939 – 1941 when several European nations had been attacked, invaded and occupied.
“It is I who pity you and your gaggle of Quixotic malcontents. You are doomed to whisper at walls the rest of your inglorious days. You deserve such contempt. You call the CIA your friends and shit on all actually existing socialism. I have no respect for you whatsoever.”
Why then do you persist in engaging with members of this forum, not once but twice?
What is your purpose in wasting your time and energy with those you hold in contempt and have no respect for?
We understand that nowadays, MS. But in 1945, the Americans believed their secret was still safe and the Russians were in the dark about it.
Only with later revelations was it learned that American (and British) security leaked like a sieve.
Mark Selden, a historian from Cornell University suggests “Impressing Russia was more important than ending the war in Japan,” but at the same time also raises other motives. Truman was also worried that he would be accused of wasting money on the Manhattan Project to build the first nuclear bombs, if the bomb was not used, he adds.
https://www.newscientist.com/article/dn7706-hiroshima-bomb-may-have-carried-hidden-agenda/
I’m quite willing to accept that demonstrating its power to the Russians could be part of the reason that Japan’s surrender offers were rejected. That also simple revenge was also involved in the decision to destroy two Japanese cities along with the firebombing of the other cities.
A member has made a special study of Hiroshima and Nagasaki and the reasons behind the bombings.
Part 1
Part2
He specifically mentions the point TS makes.
“…A number of ‘revisionist’ historians confidently assert that the primary motive was to gain diplomatic advantage: a powerful political lever allowing the US to dominate future negotiations with the Soviet Union. They make a powerful case and undoubtedly this was a major consideration in the formulation of atomic policy. But this could have been accomplished with just a single bomb and, surely, not necessarily on a heavily-populated city…”
Anyways, weren’t Russian intelligence already well aware through a network of espionage about the development and capabilities of the atomic bomb sucha= as by Klaus Fuchs although the discovery were only made in the 1950s
82-yr old Queen Margrethe II of Denmark is Europe’s longest-serving monarch and only reigning queen.
After 50 years on the throne, Margrethe is now the longest-serving living monarch in the world.
Her son, Crown Prince Frederik, 54, is due to succeed her.
The second-longest-serving monarch is King Carl XVI Gustaf of Sweden, who has been on the throne for 49 years.
The Sultan of Brunei has been on the throne for 54 years, but opinions are divided as to whether he should be considered the world’s longest-serving monarch, due to the fact that the country only became independent from Britain in 1984.
Rather than have a repetition of a debate that previously took place with TS in some detail, those interested can read the exchanges that took place here on another topic thread.
Katyn Forest and Furr’s historical revisionism of the massacre begins here
Disgraced son, Andrew, removed from any public role has got a new job – looking after his late mother’s corgi dogs.
Wez, this war-time article understandably expressed uncertainty of the stories emerging of the concentration and death camps.
https://socialiststandardmyspace.blogspot.com/2016/07/1943the-war-and-workers-1943.html
The writer was unsure whether it was the customary propaganda of enemy atrocities. But it does reveal that the truth of the Holocaust was known long before the camps were actually liberated in 1945
“…The press of this country publishes reports of the wholesale extermination of Jews in Poland. We are not able to say to what extent these reports are true. The atrocity story played its propaganda part in the last war and it is no doubt doing a similar duty in this. But bearing the record of Nazism in mind lends substance to some of these reports…”
February 1943.Moderator Comment
Thomas More’s post has somehow got lost in cyber universe. This is his missing post:-
Was the war against Nazism, in fact?
No.Never was the process of extermination disturbed by the Allies, who certainly had the power to do it. Never were the rail networks supplying the camps attacked.
No attention was paid to Jewish representatives, nor to the appeals of Kurt Gerstein, who attempted sabotage of the gassing wherever he could.I believe it was a British cabinet member who exclaimed, “Do we have to listen to these wailing Jews?” (But of this i’m not sure).
The Operation Reinhardt (Final Solution) was not of interest to the Allied war effort to disrupt. Far from it. It would prove an asset to let continue, as post-war justification for the myth of why the war was fought.
German capitalists were boosted with bonuses after the war – the same capitalists who had profited from Operation Reinhardt.
The Socialist Standard pointed out that the nationalism of the British workers only reinforced support for Hitler among the German workers.
Was the mass bombing of German cities like Dresden a war on Nazism? Or mass murder in itself?
As for the brave revolts at Treblinka and Sobibor, yes, I support them. But the mass murder of German men, women and children, no!
It is capitalism which produces these horrors, and both sides are dupes, hoodwinked by patriotism.
The UK, US, and Russia have been exploiting WW2 ever since to boost patriotism and justify wars as battles between “good” and “evil”, instead of the capitalist squabbles they really are.
I refer Wez to the Sept. 1989 issue of the Standard and the link I placed recently here on The Economic Roots.
TS, Having already explained to us previously that the war began in 2014 in a civil war against the two breakaway regions and that the Minsk Talks had broken down, can you explain why it took Putin all those years to invade?
There is much evidence of a low-level war against Russian-speaking inhabitants of Luhansk and Donetz, yet it also took Putin many years to officially recognise their independence.
Was ethnic-cleansing the real reason?
Doesn’t Russia have its own nazi problem with ultra-nationalism? Ever heard of the Russian Imperial Movement? Or the Rusich Task Force? Or the many splinter groups from Russian National Unity.
Or as we suggest, it was the broader Great Power rivalry of geo-politics in regard to economic and military alliances and the timing involved in those.
That a proxy war is the reason that Western nations are subsidizing Ukraine’s war and are not urging peace talks.
TS “So what was the Soviet Union to do after the Nazi invasion? Surrender? You must be joking?”
That is the same answer given by Zelensky.
Nor does it explain why the Communist Parties, following Moscow’s party-line still opposed the war when war was declared in 1939 and several European countries were invaded in 1940.
It is a diatribe because you throw unsubstantiated slurs such as “you are an unprincipled and unctuous charlatan.” and “you are a coward, your answer is yes. You’d willingly walk into the oven because you have no spine.”
I could go on.
If you cannot recognise the difference in the tone of my replies to you and your own, then sorry, but I pity you.
