Syria: will the West attack?

[ALB]

Isn't refugees gathering at the border to get out how the Spanish Civil War ended as one side won?

[Young Master Smeet]

An interesting quote from one reporter:https://twitter.com/jenanmoussa/status/695968654257618944

[Young Master Smeet]

https://now.mmedia.me/lb/en/NewsReports/566581-syria-kurds-press-aleppo-advancesFreedom for Kurdistan?  Looks like a referendum will occur in iraqi Kurdistan, and if they link up between Cantons on the Turkish border, it could be a fait accompli (a grateful Syrian regime probably wouldn't want to waste efforts on pushing them out.  Currently Kobane pays lip-service to being an integral part of Syria)…

[ALB]

According to this, from an Iranian news agency, the Kurdish nationalists have been getting air support from the Syrian government and Russia for these advances against the so-called "moderate" Jihadists:http://en.farsnews.com/newstext.aspx?nn=13941119001478

[Young Master Smeet]

A UN report suggests Syrian government forces are engaged in rape, torture and extermination:http://www.ohchr.org/Documents/HRBodies/HRCouncil/CoISyria/A-HRC-31-CRP1_en.pdf

Quote:

In the accounts collected from over 500 survivors of Government detention centres between March 2011 and November 2015, almost all described having been the victims of and witnesses to torture and inhuman and degrading treatment. Over 200 former Government detainees witnessed one or more deaths in custody

All sides appear to be engaged in such behaviour (although no mention of Kurds).

[ALB]

ALB wrote:

According to this, from an Iranian news agency, the Kurdish nationalists have been getting air support from the Syrian government and Russia for these advances against the so-called "moderate" Jihadists:http://en.farsnews.com/newstext.aspx?nn=13941119001478

More on this from the same source:http://en.farsnews.com/newstext.aspx?nn=13941121000772

[Young Master Smeet]

Hmmm…https://twitter.com/DrPartizan_/status/697356303908339712

Quote:

Rojava Kurdistan's administration will open an office today in Moscow, Russia.

http://www.anfenglish.com/kurdistan/rojava-canton-representation-office-to-open-in-moscow-tomorrow

[ALB]

If this report is true, that Turkey has shelled an air base recently captured from the Islamists by the Kurdish nationalists with Russian air support, this would represent a major escalation of the proxy war between Russia and Turkey:https://www.rt.com/news/332380-turkey-shells-northern-syria/Watch out for Russia's next move.

[alanjjohnstone]

Also in the news is the deployment of Saudi aircraft and support personnel to Turkey supposedly to attack ISIS but many would say it is to set up a safe haven for the Salafist opposition to protect the likes of Al Nusra from Russia while the Turks use it as an opportunity to destroy the Kurdish already existing "safe havens". https://www.rt.com/news/332354-saudi-turkey-jets-deployed/There is also the increase in accusations that the Russians are killing civilians – no doubt they are but it is sheer hypocrisy to ignore that the French/UK/US also kill civilians…they call it collateral damage. There is also the build up of troops in Eastern Europe and the Baltic states, even neutral Sweden are sabre rattling against the Russkies. http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/feb/10/uk-to-contribute-five-extra-ships-to-baltic-as-nato-boosts-presenceUK has increased its military presence in Jordan supposedly for war games. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/defence/12143515/1600-British-troops-head-to-Jordan-for-war-game.htmlThe Americans increasing their Euriopean spending and demanding the Europeans beef up their own military spending. And was it coincidence that much of the media carried stories of a Russian 3-day invasion victory…a planted story if i ever saw one. To be honest, i can't recall this much military posturing against Russia in a long long time. During my time working in air traffic control decades ago, the recce flights of the Soviet Bears was an almost daily occurrence and meant little except for a scramble of Lightning jets from Leuchars. It was all in a days work for the RAF…Now it is seen as Russian aggression, demanding diplomatic exchanges. What is the saying about sleep-walking into a war…

[ALB]

alanjjohnstone wrote:

 During my time working in air traffic control decades ago,

When I used to work in Luxemburg, decades ago too, our trade union organised the staff working for Eurocontrol, the European air traffic control organisation (above a certain height). Among other things, they used to train people from outside Europe. I remember one of them telling me that the trainees they had from Saudi Arabia thought that the world was flat because that was what the koran taught. I don't fancy a plane I'm in being guided by anyobody who thinks that (but I must have flown over so-called Saudi Arabia once on my way to visit relatives in Australia) and I pity the poor sods in Syria who are going to be accidentally bombed by pilots who believe this, though come to think of it they might bomb the Saudi royal palace thinking they are bombing Damascas.

[Dave B]

There is some truth to Adam’s seemingly outrageous statement, thus and there is now interesting wiki articles on everything; Shaykh Abdul-Aziz Ibn Baaz, the former supreme religious authority of Saudi Arabia, believed the earth is flat,[10][11]and so does Muslim Researcher on Astronomy Fadhel Al-Sa'd, who declared in a televised debate aired on IraqiAl-Fayhaa TV (October 31, 2007) that the Earth is flat as evidenced by Qur'anic verses and that the sun is much smaller than the Earth and revolves around it.[12]As devout Muslims, they have good reason to conclude the Earth is flat; the Qur'anic verses 15:19, 20:53, 43:10, 50:7, 51:48, 71:19, 78:6, 79:30, 88:20 and 91:6 all clearly state this and not a single verse in the Qur'an hint to a spherical earth https://wikiislam.net/wiki/Flat_Earth_and_the_Quran However I think for balance medieval Islam was at the time more enlightened that medieval western Christianity, even if Christianity hadn’t set the bar very high.   https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Science_in_the_medieval_Islamic_world and a pre Darwinian survival of the fittest.  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al-Jahiz Besides Algebra and the decimal number system which they probably plagiarized from the ‘Hindu’s’ who have their own strange ideas.

[alanjjohnstone]

I'd still treat the claim that Saudi air traffic controllers understood the world is flat with a healthy dose of scepticism. They be aware of the curvature of the Earth by the limits placed on the navigational aids that are line of sight and radio frequencies that aren't. (But i suppose satellites and GPS these days would easily explain the world is flat to an Islamic ATCO)But even if they did believe the world was flat, their responsibilities are geographically limited so i doubt such a belief would have any impact on their instructions to pilots…"Golf Alpha Tango, you are now approaching the edge of the world and risk flying into the unknown blackness of outer space…Please adjust your bearing and flight level to…" I was once talking to a group of Air Qatar folk in a bar once and the woman i sexistly originally thought was cabin crew turned out to be the flight engineer (she was Qatari). And to think in neighbouring Saudi Arabia females aren't allowed to drive cars… But if what you say is correct it is really a charge against modern-day Saudi Arabia and not one that applies to every Muslim in the control tower.. I am sure Muslim doctors ignore biological stuff in the Koran, just as fundamentalist doctors like Ben Carson does about the medical accuracy of the Old Testament. 

[ALB]

alanjjohnstone wrote:

But if what you say is correct it is really a charge against modern-day Saudi Arabia

That's what it was meant to be.

[alanjjohnstone]

Israel's position of turning the Palestinian future state into  "bantustans", there now preferred solution to the Syrian Civil War is now the same… the break-up of Syria…as mentioned earlier on this thread and now re-iteratedMoshe Yaalon, Israeli defence minister predicted that Syria will turn into "enclaves" under the de-facto control of religious and ethnic sects. Israel preferred the Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant (ISIL) group over Iranian-backed armed groups in southern Syria, near the border of the Israeli-occupied Golan Heights.Speaking to Israel's Army Radio on Sunday, Ram Ben-Barak, director-general of Israel's Intelligence Ministry, also described partition as "the only possible solution". "I think that ultimately Syria should be turned into regions, under the control of whoever is there”http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2016/02/israeli-minister-suggests-sectarian-partition-syria-160214151440114.htmlHmmmm???…Is this Israel calling for Syria to be wiped from the face of the map….

[alanjjohnstone]

Have Turkey and Saudi Arabia decided to go it alone? Or at least make people believe they are willing to do so. Soldiers from 20 countries will be gathering in Saudi Arabia for massive military exercises that are to go on for 18 days, the official Saudi Press Agency (SPA) said.The “Northern Thunder” exercise will take place in the north of the country and will include air, sea and land forces. SPA said that it will show that Riyadh and its allies “stand united in confronting all challenges and preserving peace and stability in the region.” Among the participants will be Arab and African countries. The US and other Western powers have not been invited.“Bashar al-Assad will leave – have no doubt about it. He will either leave by a political process or he will be removed by force,” Adel al-Jubeir the Saudi Foreign Minister told CNN.https://www.rt.com/news/332454-saudi-arabia-big-drills/

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