Russian Tensions

November 2024 Forums General discussion Russian Tensions

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  • #227782
    ALB
    Keymaster

    And I hope you are wrong this time, Abenezer. I imagine everybody does, even you.

    #227783
    Anonymous
    Inactive

    https://www.yahoo.com/news/russia-deploys-mystery-munition-ukraine-114716254.html

    Russia deploy mystery munition in Ukraine

    PS: Probably NATO and the USA are studying all the types of weapons that the Russian have used in this war

    #227784
    Anonymous
    Inactive

    Correct. Fascism is simply capitalism minus any workers’ “rights.”

    That is one of the definitions of the leftwingers. Workers do not have any rights, our only choice is to select our own masters

    #227785
    alanjjohnstone
    Keymaster

    ALB – “…At some point the war will end and their will be a settlement. What will it be? How can we know? How can anyone know? But I think we can rule out a permanent Russian occupation of the whole of Ukraine. Ukraine joining NATO is out too. That leaves plenty of room for a whole range of possible solutions. For what it’s worth (and that’s not much) I don’t think there will be an escalation to a wider war or it becoming another Afghanistan for Russia…”

    We have already been caught on the wrong foot by trying to second guess the future.

    Being a pessimistic glass-half-empty person I can only foresee a global economic recession, worldwide food and fuel shortages and political destabilization in many countries arising from the former.

    This will lead to further confrontations yet unforeseen that may well be bloodier than Ukraine. Remember the Rwanda genocide? No need for missiles or tanks. Not even bullets. Over half a million were killed with simple machetes and axes.

    I don’t believe there is going to be a swift conclusion to the conflict. It may only enter another phase.

    Is the occupation of the Donbas not conceivable and could it be acceptable to Ukraine?

    If the Russians do withdraw, there are still the issue of war reparations to be demanded by Ukraine.

    This will drag on and on and 3 million refugees will eventually begin to face discrimination and prejudice in the competition for jobs and housing in the already fragile economies of Eastern Europe. (The first victims being the Ukrainian Roma is a good bet)

    With international aid diverted to support Ukraine, that means even less to be spent elsewhere in the world which returns me to my point on the lasting impact of the war that we so far cannot imagine. But something somewhere will happen

    #227786
    alanjjohnstone
    Keymaster

    An escalation?

    An international peacekeeping mission with military capability should be sent to Ukraine, the leader of Poland’s ruling party has suggested while on a symbolic trip to Kyiv.

    “I think that it is necessary to have a peace mission – Nato, possibly some wider international structure – but a mission that will be able to defend itself, which will operate on Ukrainian territory,” Jaroslaw Kaczynski said.

    ———–

    Trade threatened

    Economic growth in Europe will be “severely impacted” in the wake of sanctions against Russia, the EU’s trade chief has warned.

    Valdis Dombrovskis, the European Commissioner for Trade, warned of higher inflation, pressure on energy and food prices, market volatility and disruption to supply chains.

    But, speaking after a meeting of EU finance ministers in Brussels, Dombrovskis added it was “impossible” to assess the exact economic impact at this stage.

    —————

    Covid?

    Russian vaccine supply?

    https://www.clinicaltrialsarena.com/special-focus/ukraine-crisis/russia-sanctions-sputnik-covid-19-vaccine-production/

    ————-

    #227788
    Anonymous
    Inactive

    I do not think that we tried to predict or guess the future, our analysis was based on the actual events that were occurring at that time, Peacetime is war too or the continuation of the politic of wars

    #227789
    Anonymous
    Inactive

    There are several countries in Latin America that depend on Russian vaccines, Many peoples vaccinated with Sputnik will not be able to enter the USA and it has not been approved by WHO

    https://www.wilsoncenter.org/blog-post/latin-americas-stranded-sputniks

    #227790
    alanjjohnstone
    Keymaster

    Libcom contributor posted a Lenin article that those who come across Leninist pro-Russian advocates such as Robbo has done, might be useful in quoting

    https://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1904/feb/03.htm

    “…The riches of the Russian bourgeoisie have been created by the impoverishment and the ruin of the Russian workers—and so now, in order to multiply these riches, the workers must shed their blood to give the Russian bourgeoisie a free hand in conquering and enslaving the Chinese and the Korean working man.
    This criminal war, which holds in store immense calamities for the working people, has been engendered by the interests of the greedy bourgeoisie, the interests of capital, which is prepared to sell and ruin its own country in its drive for profit. This hazardous gamble involving the blood and property of Russian citizens is the result of the policy of a despotic government which tramples all human rights and keeps its people in servitude. In response to the wild war-cries, in response to the “patriotic” flag-waving by the flunkeys of the money-bag and the lackeys of the police-whip, the class-conscious Social-Democratic proletariat must come forward and demand with tenfold energy: “Down with the autocracy!”….”

    “…Long live the fraternal union of the proletarians of all countries fighting for complete liberation from the yoke of international capital! Long live Japanese Social-Democracy protesting against the war! Down with the ignominious and predatory tsarist autocracy!”

    #227791
    Anonymous
    Inactive

    Those pro Russians know that but they do not care. I have read thousands of them in Latin Americans forums and most of them support conspiracist theories

    #227792
    Anonymous
    Inactive

    Movimiento, that’s why I put “rights” in inverted commas. They are a bourgeois concept.

    #227793
    robbo203
    Participant
    #227794
    ALB
    Keymaster

    Alan, none of your predictions are incompatible with what I suggested are unlikely to happen in Ukraine (no Russian occupation of the whole of Ukraine, no new Afghanistan, no spread of the war beyond Ukraine).

    I think you are right that the war and the sanctions imposed on Russia will have far-reaching repercussions outside the area of Ukraine.

    For instance, the temporary cutting off of wheat exports from Ukraine to the Middle East and North Africa and the increase in the price of bread there could lead to bread riots and the toppling of governments.

    The economic war between the West and Russia, with sanctions and counter measures, will disrupt world trade and risk another world downturn.

    Measures to reduce dependence on Russian oil and gas imports will slow down the phasing out of burning fossil fuels. There is already talk of keeping coal mines open longer and of more drilling for oil and gas in the North Sea.

    In fact future historians may well regard the Russian invasion of Ukraine in 2022 as one of the key events of the 21st century.

    #227795
    alanjjohnstone
    Keymaster

    From Cde Browne who has access to the Washington Post which is behind a pay-wall.

    The possible nuclear option

    https://socialismoryourmoneyback.blogspot.com/2022/03/the-nuclear-option.html

    #227796
    ALB
    Keymaster

    Here is the view of another comrade who is not on this forum:

    “I have to say I personally don’t agree at all this has been somehow started by the West, whatever their faults. In fact the very notion strikes me as bizarre and out of touch. Putin for years has wanted to recreate Tsarist Russia but no-one realised just how far he would go. As I’ve mentioned, if the West made a mistake it was over 20 years ago when Putin sounded Clinton and George W out about joining NATO and was rebuffed.

    We can’t do or say anything that gives an ounce of sympathy or understanding to Russia, or tail-ends the left who have cosied up to him for years on the basis that an enemy of an enemy is a friend. For one thing they just don’t get that the US is no longer the gendarme of the world it once was, it’s all much more complicated now.

    All we can do is express sympathy and solidarity with both the Ukrainian workers and those in the Russian army getting murdered because of the imperial fantasies of their leader.”

    #227797
    Anonymous
    Inactive
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