Russian Tensions
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A well-argued case on behalf of the “isolationist” section of the US capitalist class that Bijou mentions:
https://www.newsweek.com/us-needs-change-course-right-now-ukraine-opinion-1749740?amp=1
Musk, too, seems to be talking sense for once.
Will the currently politically dominant section of the US capitalist class really allow — and arm — the Ukraine regime to ethnically cleanse Crimea and the Donbass, with the massacres and streams of refugees this will involve?
Will Putin really allow the annexed territories and Crimea to go to Ukraine?
My guess is either:
Next year will see a massive Russian blitzkrieg on Ukraine,
Or: Putin has decided to hold the areas he has and will concentrate on defending them in a perpetual border war.
Anti-NATO protests are spreading across Europe. The rabble are coming for the imperialist war mongers.
Russia’s invasion of Ukraine is entirely justifiable.
https://www.unz.com/mwhitney/some-of-us-dont-think-the-russian-invasion-was-aggression-heres-why/
Russia’s offer to begin peace talks rebuffed by US.
US Rejection Of Moscow’s Offer For Peace Talks Is Utterly Inexcusable
What TS has not said is that in Germany, for instance, the protests have been organised by the German Right wing Populist party, the AFD, often described as being neo Nazi.
https://www.dw.com/en/germany-far-right-demo-protests-russia-sanctions-energy-policy/a-63380291
The same AFD “Neo Nazis” that have arranged visits to the Russian Duma:
German far-right MPs to visit Russian-occupied eastern Ukraine
The links between the ADF are allegedly long standing with some of the racist propaganda such as the “liza Story, used by the ADF being supported by the likes of Sergie Lavrov.
https://theconversation.com/how-russians-have-helped-fuel-the-rise-of-germanys-far-right-105551
The so called struggle by Putin to get rid of the Nazis is clearly a hollow claim.
This does not mean that the US and NATO are without blame in the development of the war.
However this gangster turf war is not in the interest of the workers of the West or of the Eastand suggesting that Socialists should take sides is like Socialists being asked to take sides between Al Capone and Bugs Moran.
“What TS has not said is that in Germany, for instance, the protests have been organised by the German Right wing Populist party, the AFD, often described as being neo Nazi.”
Yes, this is the spin the lame stream media is giving the protests to discredit them and discourage more plebs from joining in. Bojo’s Brains has clearly fallen for the ruse. Why is that not surprising?
“However this gangster turf war is not in the interest of the workers of the West or of the East”
It’s certainly in their interests that it ends. The cost of living crisis, particularly with regards energy, is directly related to NATO sanctions on Russia. Organise an anti-NATO protest of your own if you think the others too “right wing”. You’ve an entire “party” apparatus at your disposal do you not? Mobilize your members, hit the streets, call for the heads of the NATO warmongers to roll! Or, as I suspect, are you all just a bunch of do nothing posers?
“NATO planned a pre-emptive strike on Russia”
“According to the legend of the maneuvers, it was determined that in response to the alleged Russian intervention, the forces of the NATO coalition would form and send an aircraft carrier strike group led by the Charles de Gaulle aircraft carrier to the combat area in order to “stop the invasion and preserve the sovereignty of Ukraine.”
https://thesaker.is/nato-planned-a-pre-emptive-strike-on-russia/
TS’s response to any media story which doesn’t fit his pro Putin narrative is to cry “fake news”.
I wonder where he got that technique from?
The point is, TS, the SPGB protest about both sides, not cheerleading one set of gangsters against the other.
The problem isn’t ultimately about NATO, or for that matter Putin’s war machine. The problem is the social system from which war, the system of private property, buying and selling commodities etc. derives. You might try thinking about this, it’s a viewpoint that’s known as Marxism.
From this (Marxist) viewpoint, attempting to alter the effects of the system is futile, the thing to do is to remove it.
To try and explain this to you from your simplistic world view of a movie populated with goodies and baddies, what we’re saying is that there are two sets of baddies and the movie’s shit.
“TS’s response to any media story which doesn’t fit his pro Putin narrative is to cry “fake news”.”
The “pro-Putin narative”? Bojo’s Brain Aneurysm is getting his talking points directly from the CIA now? A Marxist he is not.
“I wonder where he got that technique from?”
Stating facts? Erm, I got that from reality. It’s a place many of us live. Not you though.
“The point is, TS, the SPGB protest about both sides, not cheerleading one set of gangsters against the other.”
I support the victims of imperialism not its proponents.
“The problem isn’t ultimately about NATO”
Actually, the problem is NATO and the imperialist designs of its members ruling classes.
“or for that matter Putin’s war machine.”
“Putin’s war machine”? What fascile drivel. It’s the military wing of the Russian state.
“The problem is the social system from which war, the system of private property, buying and selling commodities etc. derives.”
And NATOstani imperialism. Which the Russian state is pitted against.
“You might try thinking about this, it’s a viewpoint that’s known as Marxism.”
Marx said the purpose of the philosopher was to change the world. I don’t see any evidence of your party having achieved any change whatsoever. All you do is bitch and moan about everyone, capitalist and socialist alike, and proclaim
how you’re the only pure as driven snow True Scotsmen. You’re a bunch of ne’er do well jokers one and all.“From this (Marxist) viewpoint, attempting to alter the effects of the system is futile, the thing to do is to remove it.”
Really? Had much luck with that?
“To try and explain this to you from your simplistic world view of a movie populated with goodies and baddies”
The world really is populated with goodies and baddies.
“what we’re saying is that there are two sets of baddies and the movie’s shit.”
So no goodies? Only baddies? The only thing shit is your world view. It makes no friggin sense.
So no anti-NATO protest then? I guess it’s too much to expect from a mutual masturbation society. All that wrist work is kind of exhausting.
“The world really is populated with goodies and baddies”
Does TS really believe that a scumbag sociopathic capitalist like Putin who heads a corrupt far-right authoritarian imperialist state like Russia is a “goody” worth supporting? True, there is not much to choose between this regime and the obnoxious Ukrainian regime but then the SPGB on principle does not support either side in this sordid capitalist squabble. TS does and in his craven support of the Russian capitalist state and its imperialist ambitions, he demonstrates just what an anti-socialist he truly is. True Scotsman = True nationalist = True apologist for capitalism!
“Does TS really believe that a scumbag sociopathic capitalist”
Putin is a politician not a businessman so already you sound like a frothing ignoramus. Is Russia wholly capitalist? No, it’s a mixed economy. More ignorance on display. Is he a scumbag? I don’t know what use the term is in a discussion such as this. He is human with qualities both good and bad like anyone else.
“Putin who heads a corrupt far-right”
Define far right? There is government subsidised health care, no death penalty, women are in positions of power, abortion is legal, schooling free.
“authoritarian”
One cannot have civilization without authoritarianism or probably even a society for that matter. You hate it so much go live in a cave in the mountains so you can be completely free of any kind of coercion.
“imperialist state like Russia”
Russia is not imperialist. It preserved Syria from defeat to US imperialism, aids Cuba, Venezuela and Iran against the great Satan and is working closely with socialist China to bring about a multi-polar world free of US/EU hegemony.
“True, there is not much to choose between this regime and the obnoxious Ukrainian regime”
Rubbish. One is outright fascist, the other is not.
“but then the SPGB on principle does not support either side in this sordid capitalist squabble.”
Lol. The Socialist Posers Guardian Bros has no principles. Shitting on real socialism is not a principle.
“TS does and in his craven support of the Russian capitalist state and its imperialist ambitions”
Supporting a victim against a serial killer does not mean the victim is perfect. But the serial killer is way worse and the victim deserves one’s sympathy and aid. You never know, you might be the next target.
“he demonstrates just what an anti-socialist he truly is.”
You are a liberal posing as a socialist. You have no idea what socialism actually is.
“True Scotsman = True nationalist = True apologist for capitalism!”
No, that is what a liberal is.
“I support the victims of imperialism not its proponents.”
But in another thread you stated you supported the Chinese communist Party and the current Chinese regime, the imperialist force that annexed the de-facto independent country of Tibet. Presumably that was to protect the poor citizens of Tibet from that well know Nazi, the Dalai Lama
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