Russian Tensions
December 2024 › Forums › General discussion › Russian Tensions
Tagged: to manipulate
- This topic has 5,322 replies, 40 voices, and was last updated 1 day, 16 hours ago by h.moss@swansea.ac.uk.
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September 26, 2022 at 7:24 am #233656AnonymousInactive
All those ex CIA agent who become journalists they are double edge blades
September 26, 2022 at 7:37 am #233657AnonymousInactiveSeptember 26, 2022 at 12:35 pm #233667TrueScotsmanBlocked““a recognised pro-Russian propagandist”
Apologies to Lizzie. I thought this statement was directed at me. I think Lizzie is mistaken to believe Scott Ritter a propagandist. He is anti-Nazi however so not at all sympathetic to the Ukrainians.
- This reply was modified 2 years, 3 months ago by TrueScotsman.
September 26, 2022 at 4:13 pm #233679AnonymousInactiveScott Ritter does not know what Nazism really is, he just has the same opinion of the bunch of ignorants who see Nazism all over the earth, he is also a Republican right winger, and all Republican support Qanon who also have branches in Russia and they support Putin,and they support white nationalism and christian nationalism, both sides are a bunch of recalcitrants and reactionaries
https://consortiumnews.com/2022/09/26/chris-hedges-fascism-is-returning/ This guy is an alarmist, many peoples did not vote for anyone of them, it might happen like in Chile,( 47% did not vote for anybody ) where the presidents practically was kicked out on a referendum made to him instead of the constitution and now the left is making alliance with the right, and moving to the so called center left, and in less than three months his popularity was equal to the right wingers, or the so called fascists. People switch from left to right and from right to left, they do not know what they want, they are looking for shortcuts.
PS Trotskyists and Anarchists voted against the president of Chile and they knew that the right or the so called fascist was going to be winner. The communist party of Chile which talked a lot about fascism and against the fascist forces of the state, now they are ministers of the armed forces, and they are supporting the imprisonment of members of the working and class and the poor Mapuches
September 27, 2022 at 10:47 am #233703alanjjohnstoneKeymasterCurious about the use of battlefield nukes and their effect, I read this February 2022 article on the hypothetical scenario of Russia using a 10-kiloton nuclear weapon and was surprised by how feasible it was if Putin sought to make a statement on Russian resolve rather than gain any real actual tactical advantage.
America Isn’t Ready for Russia’s Battlefield Nuclear Weapons
How would the West respond when such a nuke that inflicts relatively little damage (if the article is scientifically valid) but delivers a very big message?
September 27, 2022 at 6:28 pm #233728DJPParticipantFrom the article above:
“Using the formulae found in Samuel Glasstone and Philip Dolan’s The Effects of Nuclear Weapons, some interesting results present themselves. First, if the Russians were to detonate their 10-kiloton nuclear weapon at a height of burst 587.6 feet above ground level, the ensuing fireball would not reach the ground. Thus, this “fallout free” detonation would not create the nuclear fallout zone that many Americans think results from a nuclear detonation. It would essentially result in a “clean” detonation.”
If this is true it cancels my previous comment about fallout being a reason for Russia to not use nukes.
September 27, 2022 at 11:31 pm #233735alanjjohnstoneKeymasterWho benefits from the Russian sanctions?
The 72.5-metre Axioma was seized from the steel billionaire Dmitry Pumpyansky in March after sanctions by the UK, EU and the US.
However, the yacht was not sold for the benefit of the Ukrainian people but for a US investment bank, JP Morgan, which claims Pumpyansky owes it €20.5m.
JP Morgan said the fact the billionaire had been subjected to sanctions meant the terms of the loan had been breached because it legally could not accept repayments from Pyrene
September 27, 2022 at 11:52 pm #233736alanjjohnstoneKeymasterAn interesting essay on whether the Russian invasion was legal and if in fact “legality” is relevant.
“…International law is clear: The presence of an adversary military alliance on Russia’s border is not an armed attack that could justify self-defence by force under jus contra bellum. Likewise, the separatist regions of Ukraine do not satisfy the criteria of statehood for Russia to assert the right to join any collective self-defence. Humanitarian intervention by force to protect civilians without UN Security Council authorisation remains illegal. That is according to Russia’s own judgement on NATO’s bombing of Belgrade in 1999.
However, the fact that these are not legal justifications for the use of force does not mean that they bear no legal significance. On the contrary, they point to the need for a harder look at allegations of violation of other branches of international law that just do not receive the same level of attention as jus contra bellum and international humanitarian law.
For instance, there is a debate on whether the verbal promises made by officials of NATO states in the early 1990s not to expand the alliance eastward represent legally binding obligations that have since been breached. Allegations of violations of human rights law against Russian minorities in Ukraine have also been made…”September 27, 2022 at 11:57 pm #233737AnonymousInactiveIt was the same analysis made in regard to the war in Iraq, there is not any legal or ilegal war, they are criminals
and for marketsSeptember 28, 2022 at 12:15 am #233738alanjjohnstoneKeymasterDJP, I was surprised by the minimal effect of tactical battlefield nukes and I added the caveat that it depends on the accuracy of the research. It came from 1977, almost 50 years old, so does it still stand? I don’t have the technical expertise to judge.
Here is the full study
https://atomicarchive.com/resources/documents/effects/glasstone-dolan/
Here is a 2007 update
https://www.princeton.edu/~aglaser/lecture2007_weaponeffects.pdf
But regardless of the effects, the most important aspect is how it is perceived by politicians. It could be viewed as a fait accompli and only condemned. Or it could be tit for tat with a similar response on some low populated region of Russia. But the real issue is whether would it lead to escalation and does the standard MAD deterrent theory still hold?
September 28, 2022 at 8:04 am #233746Thomas_MoreParticipantAre we to expect nuclear war drills and all of us being forced into them?
If not, how come?September 28, 2022 at 10:23 am #233752TrueScotsmanBlocked“Scott Ritter does not know what Nazism really is”
I see, but you do because you’re so much more clever than he. Give me a break. I guess this Jewish group doesn’t know what Nazism really is either.
https://forward.com/news/462916/nazi-collaborator-monuments-in-ukraine/
September 28, 2022 at 10:37 am #233754Thomas_MoreParticipantZelenskyy is Jewish, isn’t he?
Nazis are unpleasant racist people, but Nazism as a state ideology came about through the specific conditions of 1920s Germany. It cannot exist as such in modern Europe, regardless of neo-Nazi wannabes and racist groups. The closest thing to it is Putin’s Russia, which is in a similar position to Hitler’s Germany in the 1930s. This is not to justify the Ukrainian state at all, by the way, and it is NATO that has helped to create a militaristic Russia. The racism might not be present in Russia, not against Jews that is, but likely as not against Tatars, but the regimentalised, militarised nature of Nazism is there in the new Russian nationalism, together with the repression of dissidents and of the press.
September 28, 2022 at 12:32 pm #233798AnonymousInactiveNazism/Fascism is just an extreme nationalist form adopted by German and Italian capitalism between two wars based on the dictatorship of one single party, ( the same one propagated by the Bolsheviks ) and its principal characteristic is not racism, and racism is also a product of capitalism, and before the nazis emerged there was racism. Nazis and Fascists were ultimately defeated during WW2, by exterior forces, there are some neo nazis groups but they do not have the same economic and political power that the Nazis had, even more, some of those groups they do not even know what Nazism really was, they think it is only a white nationalism movement, and the Nazis made an alliance with countries and capitalist class there were not white or Europeans.
The Nazi capitalists wanted to expand capitalism out of their frontiers like the other European powers, and capitalist expansion is an inherent law of capitalism which was also explained by Rosa Luxembourg
The ones who created the concept of post-fascism and post-nazism were the Stalinists, ( and the Trotskyists ) and they used it as a pretext to eliminate their opposition. Scott Ritter has the same definition that all people ( popularity does not make anything to be correct ) have about Nazism including the leftwingers who also see Nazis all over the earth. Like the Russian capitalists used it as a pretext for an invasion like the European powers did during WW2, and the soviets to conquer territories and spheres of influence, criminal eliminating criminals
Nazism does not exist, and the so-called anti-fascists are not anti-fascists either, even more, the followers of Trump and Donald Trump himself are not fascists, and Fascism comes in two forms, fascism and anti-fascism. ironically Winston Churchill said that the new fascists will call themselves anti-fascists
He is just a Republican right-winger and ex-CIA agent with some leftist point of view because there are not any essential differences between right and left and they switch from one stand to another stand, there were also a bunch of republicans who did not support the war in Iraq and did not support George Bush including many members of the Lincoln Project.
I know about CIA agents with a Maoist point of view used to penetrate the leftist movements and CIA guerrillas too, the same shit as the soviets and the Russian capitalists.
The real German Nazis had influences in Latin America which is not a region dominated by Europeans or white peoples, showing that racism is not the main distinction of Nazism, and one ex-Nazis was president of Paraguay and Domingo Peron also supported the Nazis and the Fascist of Germany and Italy, In Iran and some Arabian countries they also had influences and some leaders supported them, even more, the government established in Paraguay was not fascists or nazis, and the government of Chile during Augusto Pinochet was not fascists, it was fascist according to the wrong version of the Stalinists of the CPC, and they used it in 2021 to win the election and now they are making an alliance with the so-called fascists.
September 28, 2022 at 1:21 pm #233805TrueScotsmanBlocked“Zelenskyy is Jewish, isn’t he?”
The good old ,”But Zelensky is Jewish!” Natostani talking point. Yeah, and the Nazis hate him. They’ve threatened to kill him multiple times whether by stringing him up on a tree branch or blowing him to bits. And guess who else Nazis hate just as much as Jews? Russians! Can you believe it?!
And here’s a by no means exhaustive list of MSM headlines about Ukraine’s Nazi problem.
15,000 Ukraine nationalists march for divisive Bandera – Jan 1 2014 – USA Today
Is the US backing neo-Nazis in Ukraine? – Feb 25 2014 – Salon
How the far-right took top posts in Ukraine’s power vacuum – Mar 5 2014 – Channel 4
Rein in Ukraine’s neo-fascists – Mar 6 2014 – CNN
Denying the Far-Right Role in the Ukrainian Revolution – Mar 7 2014 – FAIR
The Neo-Nazi Question in Ukraine – Mar 11 2014 – Huffpost
Yes, There Are Bad Guys in the Ukrainian Government – Mar 18 2014 – Foreign Policy
Analysis: U.S. Cozies Up to Kiev Government Including Far Right – Mar 30 2014 – NBCnews
Profile: Ukraine’s ultra-nationalist Right Sector – Apr 28 2014 – BBC
The Neo-Nazi Question in Ukraine – May 11 2014 – Huffpost
Fascism returns to the continent it once destroyed – May 12 2014 – TNR
Ukraine conflict: ‘White power’ warrior from Sweden – Jul 16 2014 – BBC
Preparing for War With Ukraine’s Fascist Defenders of Freedom – Aug 30 2014 – Foreign Policy
German TV Shows Nazi Symbols on Helmets of Ukraine Soldiers – Sep 9 2014 – NBCnews
Azov fighters are Ukraine’s greatest weapon and may be its greatest threat – Sep 10 2014 – Guardian
Volunteer Ukrainian unit includes Nazis – Mar 10 2015 – USA Today
US House Admits Nazi Role in Ukraine – Jun 14 2015 – Consortium News
Why Ukraine’s New Ultranationalist Party Will Not Last – Oct 19 2016 – Atlantic Council
Ukraine’s Hyper-Nationalist Military Summer Camp for Kids | NBC Left Field (vid) – Jul 13 2017 – NBCnews
The reality of neo-Nazis in Ukraine is far from Kremlin propaganda – Nov 9 2017 – The Hill
The US is Arming and Assisting Neo-Nazis in Ukraine, While Congress Debates Prohibition – Jan 18 2018 – The RealNews Network
In Ukraine, Ultranationalist Militia Strikes Fear In Some Quarters – Jan 30 2018 – RFERL
Commentary: Ukraine’s neo-Nazi problem – Mar 19 2018 – Reuters
America’s Collusion With Neo-Nazis – May 2 2018 – The Nation
Ukraine’s Got a Real Problem with Far-Right Violence (And No, RT Didn’t Write This Headline) – Jun 20 2018 – Atlantic Council
Ukraine, Anti-Semitism, Racism, and the Far Right – Oct 16 2018 – Atlantic Council
Azov, Ukraine’s Most Prominent Ultranationalist Group, Sets Its Sights On U.S., Europe – Nov 14 2018 – RFERL
Neo-Nazis and the Far Right Are On the March in Ukraine – Feb 22 2019 – The Nation
Ultranationalism in Ukraine – a photo essay – Apr 11 2019 – Guardian
There’s One Far-Right Movement That Hates the Kremlin – Apr 17 2019 – Foreign Policy
Is America Training Neonazis in Ukraine? – Dec 8 2019 – DailyBeast
The Azov Regiment has not depoliticized – Mar 19 2020 – Atlantic Council
Like, Share, Recruit: How a White-Supremacist Militia Uses Facebook to Radicalize and Train New Members – Jan 7 2021 – Time
Profile: Who are Ukraine’s far-right Azov regiment? – Mar 1 2022 – Aljazeerah
How Ukraine’s Jewish president Zelensky made peace with neo-Nazi paramilitaries on front lines of war with Russia – Mar 4 2022 – Grayzone
Ukraine’s Nazi problem is real, even if Putin’s ‘denazification’ claim isn’t – Mar 6 2022 – NBCnews
Right-wing Azov Battalion emerges as a controversial defender of Ukraine – Apr 6 2022 – Washington Posthttps://www.moonofalabama.org/2022/04/azovreplist.html
“Nazis are unpleasant racist people, but Nazism as a state ideology came about through the specific conditions of 1920s Germany. It cannot exist as such in modern Europe”
Erm, it does exist in Ukraine. Shut your eyes, plug your fingers in your ears, jump up and down and hum…but Ukraine will still be run by the Nazis.
“The closest thing to it is Putin’s Russia”
LOL. I see it’s say stupid shit day today. Russia doesn’t even have the death penalty, is a multi-ethnic state, is not supremacist, is not viciously anti-communist, has women in positions of authority, has democratic elections and opposition media. You really gotta stop reading the Guardian.
“and it is NATO that has helped to create a militaristic Russia.”
Name a single country on earth that has no military. And no, tiny Polynesian islands don’t count.
“The racism might not be present in Russia, not against Jews that is, but likely as not against Tatars”
Bullshit. Source?
“but the regimentalised, militarised nature of Nazism is there in the new Russian nationalism”
Bullshit. You have MSM brain worms. Better see to that.
“together with the repression of dissidents”
Right. Julian Assange, rotting in prison in London. Edward Snowden, walking free in Moscow.
“and of the press.”
You know nothing at all of Russian media except what you’ve read in the Guardian. So embarrassing.
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