Republic vs democracy vs anarchy

[Capitalist Pig]

mcolome1 wrote:

Capitalist Pig wrote:

mcolome1 wrote:

Capitalist Pig wrote:

Matt wrote:

robbo203 wrote:

Just as a matter of interest, does this mean then that you oppose the concept of democracy altogether?

He says elsewhere he is a fan of Marie Le Pen.

who is now in the process of being jailed for criticizing ISIS

Those are not the real facts, or you do not know what you are talking about.  They removed her parliamentary inmunity because she was publishing violence picture of ISIS, and under the capitalist law of France, that is prohibited with the penalty of being taken to prison or the imposition of a heavy fine.The main problem of France is not ISIS, it is only a distraction, the real problem is capitalism, and it has been discovered that the terrorists attacks made in France have been committed by the same terrorists that they have trained, andf they want those terrorists  actions to be committed to have excuses to continue the war in the Middle East, and  to produce fear within the French populationIf they are going to publish pictures of violence, they also should publish the pictures of the atrocities and fascists acts committed by the Westerrn Powerr and the USA in Iraq, where they dropped depleted uranium, mini nukes,  and millions of bombs against the population, and they destroyed everthing, and more than 1.5 millions people were killed, and there are children that are born without legs, without arms, and with cancer , leukemia, with large tumors due to atomic radiation.  They have also dropped bombs on hospitals, actions that were not effected  by the German Nazi in WWII, the terrorists attacks of the western power in Iraq are  worst than the terrorist attacks made in Hiroshima and Nagasaki, where a whole population of inocent peoples were used to scierntific atomic experiments, and they have dropped more bombs than during WWIIISIS is their product, produced by the wars in the Middle East, and they have used ISIS in order to carry their criminals acts to overthrow goverments, to make war against the goverment that do not support them, , and to overthrow leaders like they did in Lybia, and many young peoples have joint ISIS because many of their relatives have been killed, and the leaders of ISIS have used that excuse to obtain more membership. They whole middle east is a mess produced by the USA and the Western powers and the real intention is petroleum, minerals and opiumThe army of ISIS has been financed by the Western Power and the USA goverment, even more, many report have shown that the amount of attacks made against ISIS is only a lie, they have only destroyed those members of ISIS who have opposed their own creator, like in Benghazi, where the US embassy was a nest of terrorists and criminals, and some groups of terrorists attacked the embassyThese are only fight between bandits of capitalism trying to take control of the state and the economy in detriment of the working class, and to impose neo-fascists, and neo-Nazis agenda, who ever support them, can also support the Italian Fascists and the German Nazis

nice conspirecy theory. her immunity has been removed from the EU because she criticized ISIS by esposing their atrocities but according to you, thats ok! who needs free elections just jail those who you disagree with. You have sunk to a new low by saying such things. The real problem isn't ISIS so just let them keep raping and killing people in the name of allah? You are so blinded by your ideology you can't see the light of day, if a terrorist murdered someone right in front of you I bet you would look the other way and blame capitalism. Just disgusting.Obama did fund and support isis though, the millitary rebeled and ended up bombing the shit out of them near the end of his administration.

Now you call conspiracy theory the same laws that you have been defending, or what is known as the capitalist legal system. This is not a matter of legality, illegality, or conspiracy, these are strugles between bandits of capitalism.  I can sink  lower ( repeating the expression of you Caesar ) . I can say that the problem of the world and the USA is not Donald Trump either , it is the economical system that he represents, and the ruling class that is behind  every president, and every president has his or her own boss.Obama is not the only president of the US who had financed terrorists and criminals, the first terrorist was George Washington and the trend has continued until the present time, and also he is not acting like an individual, he is just following the law of market which is the real root of wars, there is not president or politician able to change the law of marketRonald Reagan supported and financed Al Qaeda, and they were called the freedom fighter, and the Nicaragua Contra which were a groups of terrorists  financed with drugs  by the goverment of Ronald Regan, and the Kosovo freedom fighter were supported by the organized crime and the western powers, they also made alliance with the Sicilian Mafia to invade Italy during WWII.  

humans have been killing eachother for shit since the end of time. tribalism is natural.you can say what you want about donald trump but he was the outsider and he won. For the first time in a very long time we have a president that will look out for our interests instead of the interests of multinational corporations. You will try to divide us by income but I see myself as an american not a capitalist or a worker.

[Capitalist Pig]

we have gotton off topic, we are supposed to be talking about the practibility of the various types of government in a planned economy. what are your thoughts and if you already posted it expand on it

[alanjjohnstone]

CP, i have given you credit for being a thinking person but i might well be wrong, after reading your reply to my previous response to you.The fact is that my online search did bring up that evidence which contradicts your own allegations, which is based on your own  internet reading  and it is up to you to undermine them as reliable sources by exposing the factual errors or the mistaken conclusions. Argue your case, don't simply make assertions.Simply labelling them as "propaganda outlets", simply isn't a good enough, or an intellectually honest answer.But perhaps you think your own Brietbart- like sources are more accurate. If so demonstrate their validity. and accuracy.I purposefully did a mix of sources just to minimise the reliance on a left-wing source, unless you think the UK Independent newspaper and Snopes website are left-fronts for Soros.The long quoted article you so casually disregard fully acknowledged the Soros funding of certain elements in the BLM but identified who and why, and that it as not as some claimed – paying for rioter-for-hire but to divert the protest movement into more acceptable and constitutional legal channels. And as you are seemingly a staunch supporter of the US Constitution, Soros doing the exact same as the Koch Brothers i.e. using their personal wealth to try and determine a political outcome,  where is the problem for you?  That linked article then went on to explain why particular political currents seek to blame Soros for all the opposition and resistance, long before Trump or the alt-right made a political appearance – a very unpalatable explanation for yourself no doubt, but one that you did not care to address. He is blamed for instance for the Ukrainian coup  which conveniently diverts from the US government's $5 billion dollars to support the right-wing in the Ukraine. Either you respond with some substance to your claims and engage in serous debate, or i will simply cease trying to have a constructive dialogue with you. 

[Anonymous]

Capitalist Pig wrote:

mcolome1 wrote:

Capitalist Pig wrote:

mcolome1 wrote:

Capitalist Pig wrote:

Matt wrote:

robbo203 wrote:

Just as a matter of interest, does this mean then that you oppose the concept of democracy altogether?

He says elsewhere he is a fan of Marie Le Pen.

who is now in the process of being jailed for criticizing ISIS

Those are not the real facts, or you do not know what you are talking about.  They removed her parliamentary inmunity because she was publishing violence picture of ISIS, and under the capitalist law of France, that is prohibited with the penalty of being taken to prison or the imposition of a heavy fine.The main problem of France is not ISIS, it is only a distraction, the real problem is capitalism, and it has been discovered that the terrorists attacks made in France have been committed by the same terrorists that they have trained, andf they want those terrorists  actions to be committed to have excuses to continue the war in the Middle East, and  to produce fear within the French populationIf they are going to publish pictures of violence, they also should publish the pictures of the atrocities and fascists acts committed by the Westerrn Powerr and the USA in Iraq, where they dropped depleted uranium, mini nukes,  and millions of bombs against the population, and they destroyed everthing, and more than 1.5 millions people were killed, and there are children that are born without legs, without arms, and with cancer , leukemia, with large tumors due to atomic radiation.  They have also dropped bombs on hospitals, actions that were not effected  by the German Nazi in WWII, the terrorists attacks of the western power in Iraq are  worst than the terrorist attacks made in Hiroshima and Nagasaki, where a whole population of inocent peoples were used to scierntific atomic experiments, and they have dropped more bombs than during WWIIISIS is their product, produced by the wars in the Middle East, and they have used ISIS in order to carry their criminals acts to overthrow goverments, to make war against the goverment that do not support them, , and to overthrow leaders like they did in Lybia, and many young peoples have joint ISIS because many of their relatives have been killed, and the leaders of ISIS have used that excuse to obtain more membership. They whole middle east is a mess produced by the USA and the Western powers and the real intention is petroleum, minerals and opiumThe army of ISIS has been financed by the Western Power and the USA goverment, even more, many report have shown that the amount of attacks made against ISIS is only a lie, they have only destroyed those members of ISIS who have opposed their own creator, like in Benghazi, where the US embassy was a nest of terrorists and criminals, and some groups of terrorists attacked the embassyThese are only fight between bandits of capitalism trying to take control of the state and the economy in detriment of the working class, and to impose neo-fascists, and neo-Nazis agenda, who ever support them, can also support the Italian Fascists and the German Nazis

nice conspirecy theory. her immunity has been removed from the EU because she criticized ISIS by esposing their atrocities but according to you, thats ok! who needs free elections just jail those who you disagree with. You have sunk to a new low by saying such things. The real problem isn't ISIS so just let them keep raping and killing people in the name of allah? You are so blinded by your ideology you can't see the light of day, if a terrorist murdered someone right in front of you I bet you would look the other way and blame capitalism. Just disgusting.                    Obama did fund and support isis though, the millitary rebeled and ended up bombing the shit out of them near the end of his administration.

Now you call conspiracy theory the same laws that you have been defending, or what is known as the capitalist legal system. This is not a matter of legality, illegality, or conspiracy, these are strugles between bandits of capitalism.  I can sink  lower ( repeating the expression of you Caesar ) . I can say that the problem of the world and the USA is not Donald Trump either , it is the economical system that he represents, and the ruling class that is behind  every president, and every president has his or her own boss.Obama is not the only president of the US who had financed terrorists and criminals, the first terrorist was George Washington and the trend has continued until the present time, and also he is not acting like an individual, he is just following the law of market which is the real root of wars, there is not president or politician able to change the law of marketRonald Reagan supported and financed Al Qaeda, and they were called the freedom fighter, and the Nicaragua Contra which were a groups of terrorists  financed with drugs  by the goverment of Ronald Regan, and the Kosovo freedom fighter were supported by the organized crime and the western powers, they also made alliance with the Sicilian Mafia to invade Italy during WWII.  

humans have been killing eachother for shit since the end of time. tribalism is natural.you can say what you want about donald trump but he was the outsider and he won. For the first time in a very long time we have a president that will look out for our interests instead of the interests of multinational corporations. You will try to divide us by income but I see myself as an american not a capitalist or a worker.

 Again, I must tell you you, you must do some reading in human history, and Anthropology. What you have said are just historical distortion. There was a longer period in the human society where peoples lived in harmony and common cooperation and peace. even more, in modern times,  religious groups like the Jews, Christian and Islamic lived together in peace and harmony for more than 900 years in the Middle EastWhich tribes ? Probably, you have not read about that either, because just a particular group like the Tainos they lived in peace for thousands of years, until their society was invaded by the European Feudalists, the USA historian known as Francis Jennings published a iong investigation about the real founders of the Americas known as the Indians and he has proven that they lived in peace and harmony for thusands of years. You must be watching too much cowboy moviesYou have been in this forum for a long time, and you should know that we define class according to their relationship with the means of corporation, the society that you are defending is the one who has divided human beings according to their income, and they have created a false concept known as the middle class, which does not exist, In this forum we have said many times that there is not president able to alter the market system, on the contrary,  the market system will alter them, therefore, there is not president separated or elevated above the economical base of any class society, it has been proven thousands of times through the economic history of the human society.There have been some  presidents who have tried  to create reform for their society and they have been overthrown by the ruling class of the same society that you are defending. Donald Trump like any other president has ihis own boss, and history has not been made by presidents or individuals, we have discussed that thousands of times in this forums. If you do not read the appropiate sources you will never learn new ideas. We guide about critical analysis based on the Materialist Conception o History, and we have explained that idea many time in this forum, if you do not read the proper sources you will not understand what we are saying in this forumAll human beings living in the Americans continents and Islands are called Americans, and that will include the peoples from the Antilles, the concept of American was created by the ruling class of the USA, even more, Mexico and Venezuela are known as United Statew, they are societies divided in Bourgoises and Proletarian, it is nothing exclusive.  

[alanjjohnstone]

Quote:

For the first time in a very long time we have a president that will look out for our interests instead of the interests of multinational corporations.

Unlike some when Trump appointed Goldman Sachs executives to his government, i gave him the benefit…set a fox to catch a fox, rather than those who saw him as having placed the foxes in the hen-house. So far, it appears by the tax change proposals, the latter explanation seems more plausible.But let us look deeper at those appointees and hat they are saying.Pruitt, head of the EPA denying CO2 as the major cause of global warming and climate change. Is he looking after your or your families or the future generations interests or continuing his policy of minimising the effect of the fossil fuel industry, which he had previously stoutly defended and served the interests of?Trumps appointee for education, DeVos. Is she advancing your or your families or the future generation's interests or promoting the policy of for-profit corporations rather than remedying the problems of public schools.As for the new Ryancare, it seems a bit like a feud between the wider business interests and the narrower healthcare corporations. Businesses believe the plan could help relieve them of costs. Health care businesses believe it will relieve them of customers, and therefore revenues. What's absent is the interests of you, your family and future generations.Then there is Gorsuch  and then trying to give us Puzder as a Labor secretary I could go on and explore Jeff Sessions, or how Flynn was on the Turkish government's pay-rollNo, looking at his policies and his appointees, the last thing Trump is doing is looking out for your interests and not the multinational corporations. 

[robbo203]

Capitalist Pig wrote:

humans have been killing eachother for shit since the end of time. tribalism is natural.

 Well no to be pedantic – tribalism is particular kind of social formation of relatively recent origin in human terms,  Human beings have been living in another kind of social formation for far longer – simple hunter gather band groups – and there is plenty of anthropological  evidence that warfare and violence was pretty rare among such groups 

Capitalist Pig wrote:

you can say what you want about donald trump but he was the outsider and he won. For the first time in a very long time we have a president that will look out for our interests instead of the interests of multinational corporations. You will try to divide us by income but I see myself as an american not a capitalist or a worker.

 You know CP it makes me sad when I read comments like this,  How you can possibly be so naive as to  believe that Trump is an outsider who represents "our" interests and not those of the capitalists (of which he is one) and their Multinationals. It is plain as plain can be that the man is a complete and utter fraud and you like millions of other american workers seem to have been taken in by the salesman's patter Come on, Trump is not interested in your interests at all and even if he was he would have no option but to adminsiter a system that can only be operated in the interests of capital and of the capitalist class.  Within days of his inauguation he had stuffed his cabinet with representatives of the  BIg Business Establishment –  some billionaires or multimillionairs like himself.  He laughablly claimed that no one did more for equality than him but the record shows he treats his own employees like utter shit  http://www.rawstory.com/2016/05/workers-at-trumps-las-vegas-hotel-struggle-to-get-by-with-low-pay-and-little-benefits/  And despite his hypocrictical patriotism Trump himself has business interests in at least 25 countires in the world http://edition.cnn.com/2016/11/28/politics/trump-foreign-businesses/ We can argue till the cows come home whether Trump is an "outsider" and what exactly is meant by an outisder.  Hitler too was an outsider – but the social origins of politicians is irrelvant, anyway    Trump is now very firmly the insider at the helm of the American regme despite sniping within by elements of the deep state – the bureaucracy Mark my words, CP, you are going to be mightility disappointed in Trump just as much as in any other previous incumbent at the White House.  It might take a few months or it might take a few years but soon or later it will happen as Trump eases himself into the all too familiar role that all Presidents have carried out as representatives of the interests of American capitalism and their capitalist class

[Anonymous]

robbo203 wrote:

Mark my words, CP, you are going to be mightility disappointed in Trump just as much as in any other previous incumbent at the White House.  It might take a few months or it might take a few years but soon or later it will happen as Trump eases himself into the all too familiar role that all Presidents have carried out as representatives of the interests of American capitalism and their capitalist class

I don't think so. It is his strong leader, right or wrong.His country right or wrong.He has been lurking in a fascist dung heap awaiting 'the call' of the Merkels and Orbáns.In the US the current round of legislation — introduced by Republican lawmakers in 19 states — attempts to criminalize and penalize protesting in various ways.https://socialismoryourmoneyback.blogspot.co.uk/2017/03/creeping-totalitarianism.html

[robbo203]

Matt wrote:

robbo203 wrote:

Mark my words, CP, you are going to be mightility disappointed in Trump just as much as in any other previous incumbent at the White House.  It might take a few months or it might take a few years but soon or later it will happen as Trump eases himself into the all too familiar role that all Presidents have carried out as representatives of the interests of American capitalism and their capitalist class

I don't think so. It is his strong leader, right or wrong.His country right or wrong.He has been lurking in a fascist dung heap awaiting 'the call' of the Merkels and Orbáns.In the US the current round of legislation — introduced by Republican lawmakers in 19 states — attempts to criminalize and penalize protesting in various ways.https://socialismoryourmoneyback.blogspot.co.uk/2017/03/creeping-totalitarianism.html

 Well lets see Matt, Even fascists have been known to change their mind and abandon their previously held convictions. My reading of the situation and dabbling in forums populated by right wing nationalists is that there s a strong sense of triumphalism in the air and an enormous expectation that things are going to change in a fundamental way.  The left and the Liberals have been routed ("libtards" is favourite expresssion of these right wing folk).  The Left and Liberal's' PC arguments have been exposed as folly.  And now, finally, ordnary folk are wresting their fate and reclaiming their future from the" establishment " that has treated them with cynical contempt decade after decade  as just election fodder. Some of what these people say strikes a chord.  It is too simplistic to dismiss all supporters of Brexit , for example, as xenopobes and racists.  Nevertheless with chauvinistc nationalism on the rise everywhere there is a coresrponding rise in expectations that things are going to be substantially different. Of course,  there is no way things are going to pan out in the way these people hope and imagine.  You cant run capitalism in the interests of the workers just as you cant run the abbatoir in the interests of the cattle, All of these developments – Trump , Le Pen, Brexit and whatnot –  are going to prove deeply disappointing in objective terms at the end of the day.  You can only bury your head in the sand for so long before  noticing something has gone seriously wrong In short what we are seeing is  an unstable power keg of frustrated hopes being built up  that could explode in the not too distant  future,  The right is on the rise today but its victory is going be a pyrrhic one,  When  the dream turns sour and the vision collapses as it surely will what is going to be the fall out from that?. Hopefully not a return to delusional policies of left wing capitalism a la Bernie Sanders and Jeremy Corbyn, Hopefully as socialists we can galvanise our fellow workers to look beyond the see-saw politics of capitalism itself.  Meaing we should be honing our arguments in a way that fully anticipates that coming fall out and unravelling of the Right itself,  hard though it may be for us  to see this now in era of Trump, Le Pen and Brexit

[Anonymous]

Of course I agree with all you had to say. But meanwhile our brother and sister fellow humans fleeing terror,famine and yes ecomomic insecurity, are being turned away from even a brief respite of asylum or sanctuary as a consequence of xenophbia being inflamed by the right and meally mouthed vacillating compromise by the left.People are having their heads broken and dieing because of these bastards.I do appreciate my intemperate response is not the  sober analysis expected of a WSM member.I will try to do better when speaking to these opportunistic scumbags.

[John Pozzi]

The basis of economics, i.e., the branch of knowledge concerned with the production, consumption, and transfer of wealth is the product of nature – not labour. If money values natural resources people are free to play. Machines can labour.

[Anonymous]

Matt wrote:

Of course I agree with all you had to say. But meanwhile our brother and sister fellow humans fleeing terror,famine and yes ecomomic insecurity, are being turned away from even a brief respite of asylum or sanctuary as a consequence of xenophbia being inflamed by the right and meally mouthed vacillating compromise by the left.People are having their heads broken and dieing because of these bastards.I do appreciate my intemperate response is not the  sober analysis expected of a WSM member.I will try to do better when speaking to these opportunistic scumbags.

If you read the opinions of those far right forum participants, you will feel that you are in Medieval times with Evangelicals. Be ready to have Phillips Magnesia at home because you are going to get some kind of stomach upset, or you are going to vomit. 

[Capitalist Pig]

alanjjohnstone wrote:

CP, i have given you credit for being a thinking person but i might well be wrong, after reading your reply to my previous response to you.The fact is that my online search did bring up that evidence which contradicts your own allegations, which is based on your own  internet reading  and it is up to you to undermine them as reliable sources by exposing the factual errors or the mistaken conclusions. Argue your case, don't simply make assertions.Simply labelling them as "propaganda outlets", simply isn't a good enough, or an intellectually honest answer.But perhaps you think your own Brietbart- like sources are more accurate. If so demonstrate their validity. and accuracy.I purposefully did a mix of sources just to minimise the reliance on a left-wing source, unless you think the UK Independent newspaper and Snopes website are left-fronts for Soros.The long quoted article you so casually disregard fully acknowledged the Soros funding of certain elements in the BLM but identified who and why, and that it as not as some claimed – paying for rioter-for-hire but to divert the protest movement into more acceptable and constitutional legal channels. And as you are seemingly a staunch supporter of the US Constitution, Soros doing the exact same as the Koch Brothers i.e. using their personal wealth to try and determine a political outcome,  where is the problem for you?  That linked article then went on to explain why particular political currents seek to blame Soros for all the opposition and resistance, long before Trump or the alt-right made a political appearance – a very unpalatable explanation for yourself no doubt, but one that you did not care to address. He is blamed for instance for the Ukrainian coup  which conveniently diverts from the US government's $5 billion dollars to support the right-wing in the Ukraine. Either you respond with some substance to your claims and engage in serous debate, or i will simply cease trying to have a constructive dialogue with you. 

your smart you can figure it out yourself. but i can tell you right now you aren't going to get anything but disinformation from snopes and organizations like it. I read parts of the article but i stopped at the "your antisemetic if your criticize george soros" because it was just so annoying to me.Certain media outlets sole purpose is to shape public opinion instead of giving you the facts. this has been the case for a while.

[Capitalist Pig]

alanjjohnstone wrote:

Quote:

For the first time in a very long time we have a president that will look out for our interests instead of the interests of multinational corporations.

Unlike some when Trump appointed Goldman Sachs executives to his government, i gave him the benefit…set a fox to catch a fox, rather than those who saw him as having placed the foxes in the hen-house. So far, it appears by the tax change proposals, the latter explanation seems more plausible.But let us look deeper at those appointees and hat they are saying.Pruitt, head of the EPA denying CO2 as the major cause of global warming and climate change. Is he looking after your or your families or the future generations interests or continuing his policy of minimising the effect of the fossil fuel industry, which he had previously stoutly defended and served the interests of?Trumps appointee for education, DeVos. Is she advancing your or your families or the future generation's interests or promoting the policy of for-profit corporations rather than remedying the problems of public schools.As for the new Ryancare, it seems a bit like a feud between the wider business interests and the narrower healthcare corporations. Businesses believe the plan could help relieve them of costs. Health care businesses believe it will relieve them of customers, and therefore revenues. What's absent is the interests of you, your family and future generations.Then there is Gorsuch  and then trying to give us Puzder as a Labor secretary I could go on and explore Jeff Sessions, or how Flynn was on the Turkish government's pay-rollNo, looking at his policies and his appointees, the last thing Trump is doing is looking out for your interests and not the multinational corporations. 

don't know much about the american heath care thing havn't read into it yet but from what I see it seems to be one huge shitstorm or alot of infighting. You have to give him some credit, he hasn't even got a full cabinet yet. When you have so many obama holdovers it is a little hard to get things done also so don't think things are that simple.

[Capitalist Pig]

should i just create a 'why trump is a facist' thread? lol….good lord

[Capitalist Pig]

 [/quote]humans have been killing eachother for shit since the end of time. tribalism is natural.you can say what you want about donald trump but he was the outsider and he won. For the first time in a very long time we have a president that will look out for our interests instead of the interests of multinational corporations. You will try to divide us by income but I see myself as an american not a capitalist or a worker.[/quote] Again, I must tell you you, you must do some reading in human history, and Anthropology. What you have said are just historical distortion. There was a longer period in the human society where peoples lived in harmony and common cooperation and peace. even more, in modern times,  religious groups like the Jews, Christian and Islamic lived together in peace and harmony for more than 900 years in the Middle EastWhich tribes ? Probably, you have not read about that either, because just a particular group like the Tainos they lived in peace for thousands of years, until their society was invaded by the European Feudalists, the USA historian known as Francis Jennings published a iong investigation about the real founders of the Americas known as the Indians and he has proven that they lived in peace and harmony for thusands of years. You must be watching too much cowboy moviesYou have been in this forum for a long time, and you should know that we define class according to their relationship with the means of corporation, the society that you are defending is the one who has divided human beings according to their income, and they have created a false concept known as the middle class, which does not exist, In this forum we have said many times that there is not president able to alter the market system, on the contrary,  the market system will alter them, therefore, there is not president separated or elevated above the economical base of any class society, it has been proven thousands of times through the economic history of the human society.There have been some  presidents who have tried  to create reform for their society and they have been overthrown by the ruling class of the same society that you are defending. Donald Trump like any other president has ihis own boss, and history has not been made by presidents or individuals, we have discussed that thousands of times in this forums. If you do not read the appropiate sources you will never learn new ideas. We guide about critical analysis based on the Materialist Conception o History, and we have explained that idea many time in this forum, if you do not read the proper sources you will not understand what we are saying in this forumAll human beings living in the Americans continents and Islands are called Americans, and that will include the peoples from the Antilles, the concept of American was created by the ruling class of the USA, even more, Mexico and Venezuela are known as United Statew, they are societies divided in Bourgoises and Proletarian, it is nothing exclusive.  [/quote]sorry it condradicts your narritive but humans have been fighting eachother forever. don't really know what to say. just saying that alot of people identify as 'americans' not 'the working class' or 'the capitalist class' myself included. who are trump's bosses then? he ran almost exclusively using his own money. If I disagree with this statement i'm not uninformed I just have an opinion that isn't yours.

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