Reply to a Sanders supporter. The same goes for Corbyn.
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A reply to another, that Sanders will not be elected anyway:
I doubt it very much. I doubt Sanders will win. Even if he did, very unlikely, he would be unable to run capitalism in the interests of the workers, any more than one can run an abattoir in the interests of the cattle. The problems which are rooted in the system itself will persist, domestic and global, and the ensuing failure to resolve them will bring him blame and a swing to the right again (which is just as useless). Only the seizure of the means of production by the working class in the name of all can bring resolution! (www.worldsocialism.org/spgb)
The can elect Karl Marx or Frederic Engels and they will not be able to change the system, it must be done by a consciousnesses world working class willing to establish a new society and with the desire the get rid of capitalism. There is not any relationship between government and democracy, it must be a post capitalist and stateless society. Karl Kaustky when he was a real socialist he explained that very clearly and he cleaned the floor with Lenin’s state and the revolution and his dictatorship of the proletariat
An article of interest
Sanders’s Speech Presents a Conundrum for New Left’s Socialist Strategy
Not as straightforward, then, as his rival for the support of leftish Democratic Party members, Elizabeth Warren, who, according to yesterday’s Times
“has said she is ‘capitalist to my bones,’ seeking to reform the system rather than tear it down.”
Can anyone cite chapter and verse for this damning admission?
I see that that the article repeats that statement too, and also uses the term “centrist neoliberal” in relation to Joe Biden — which (see the thread on Trump) the “Marxist Humanist Initiative” say people should be prepared to vote for to keep Trump out.
The article linked to might be of interest. Its the usual platitudinous wishy-washy well-meaning left capitalist crap. I get a lot of this sort of stuff in my email in-tray, subscribing as I do, to various newsletters from entities such as the Next System project which is linked to Democracy Collaborative. Its quite frustrating because there is no feedback or comment facility and I would love to be able to comment
Bernie Sanders is just putting more confusions and distortions on the distorted concept of socialism-communism. There is a new term known as socialism for the rich, this is really crazy. There is a term on the communist manifesto known as Bourgeois communism but it is totally different to the new term implying that the capitalist class is favoring the working class
The new propaganda is that capitalism and socialism can be mixed. We are coming back to the old days of Tito
Another stupid and distorted term coming from the USA political world known as: Corporate Socialism
“Not as straightforward, then, as his rival for the support of leftish Democratic Party members, Elizabeth Warren, who, according to yesterday’s Times
“has said she is ‘capitalist to my bones,’ seeking to reform the system rather than tear it down.”
Can anyone cite chapter and verse for this damning admission?”
Not her precise words as far as I can tell but someone on Twitter paraphrasing the remarks she made (below) to the New England Council on July 16, 2018.
“I believe in markets and in capitalism, and, as a long-time professor of bankruptcy law, I know how hard it is to deal with the problem of a failed business.”
https://www.warren.senate.gov/newsroom/press-releases/warren-delivers-remarks-to-new-england-council
“I am a capitalist to my bones,” Sen. Warren tells New England Council, one of several instances this morning where she’s highlighted her belief in capitalism and markets while talking bankruptcy policy #mapoli
— Katie Lannan (@katielannan) July 16, 2018
Also here in an interview with CNBC’s John Harwood:
https://www.cnbc.com/2018/07/23/elizabeth-warren-i-am-a-capitalist-but-markets-need-rules.html
Sometimes peoples proudly call themselves capitalists when they are wage slaves instead of calling themselves pro-capitalists or pro-capitalism. The new tendency around the world is that we do not have to worry about definition, but in reality is that we do not have to worry about proper . principles, but what kind of principles, because we have capitalist principles in our consciousness.
The latest blog-post on Sanders
https://socialismoryourmoneyback.blogspot.com/2019/06/bernie-sanders-is-no-eugene-debs.html
And another one waiting
There is a great difference between Bernie Sanders, Eugene Debs, and Daniel De Leon, many of the real and genuine socialists in the USA came from others countries including Canada and Great Britain . Most followers of Bernie Sanders have been convinced that capitalism and socialism can co-exist together, and that capitalism can be reformed and be run for the benefits of the working class, and that the Northern countries of Europe have a mixed economy. If we go back to history we will see that any of those concepts are not knew, they were expressed by Lenin in regarding the conception of state capitalism which could have been established to benefits the working class, and Nikita Khrushchev said that capitalism and socialism can c0- exist peaceful together, and Tito in Yugoslavia, but the Maoists and the Hoxhaists rejected all those conceptions in 1959 in one of the congress of the Communist Party of the Soviet Union. Socialism in the hands of the reformers have never advanced at least one day
Several of those so called leftists of the Democratic Party of the USA approved one of the biggest war budget in history of 750 billions dollars, and approved a large bill to help Trump with his emigration policy. So much barking for nothing, at the end they all collaborate with the ruling class. Those are the so called anti-Globalists, probably, Rosa Luxembourg should write a new preface to her book: Accumulation of capital
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