Only Vegans can save the world
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Quote:In our latest research, colleagues and I estimate that changes towards more plant-based diets in line with the WHO’s global dietary guidelinescould avert 5m-8m deaths per year by 2050. This represents a 6-10% reduction in global mortality.
Food-related greenhouse gas emissions would also be cut by more than two thirds. In all, these dietary changes would have a value to society of more than US$1 trillion – even as much as US$30 trillion. That’s up to a tenth of the likely global GDP in 2050. Our results are published in the journal PNAS.
Here's an alternative view which may bring comfort for some:The moral high ground of food just shifted a little bit. Using biophysical simulation models to compare 10 eating patterns, researchers found that eating fewer animal products will increase the number of people that can be supported by existing farmland. But as it turns out, eliminating animal products altogether isn’t the best way to maximize sustainable land use. Their work was published in Elementa, a journal on the science of the anthropocene. The researchers considered the vegan diet, two vegetarian diets (one that includes dairy, the other dairy and eggs), four omnivorous diets (with varying degrees of vegetarian influence), one low in fats and sugars, and one akin to the modern American dietary pattern. Based on their models, the vegan diet would feed fewer people than two of the vegetarian and two of the four omnivorous diets studied. The bottom line: Going cold turkey on animal-based products may not actually be the most sustainable long choice for humanity in the long term:I could not work in a slaghterhouse and do not expext anyone to do this dirty work for me. When I first realised this I became a Vegan, less than five years after joining the SPGB. This article touches on some related issues.
The World produces one and half times enough food to feed everyone on the planet – that’s 10 billion people, the population peak we expect to reach in 2050. So where's the problem….Capitalism is the fucking problem…not what we eat…Growing food to pump into our unnecessary car's combustion engine isn't too wise a choice either…Nor is filling dumpsters and landfill with unused food very clever, either.Our diet is just part of the issue. The blog post going into more detail on the research Hallblithe mentioned http://socialismoryourmoneyback.blogspot.com/2016/07/feed-world.htmlAnother blog post on the topichttp://socialismoryourmoneyback.blogspot.com/2016/04/food-or-feed.htmlThe other thread Marxist Animalism has quite a few references to our diethttp://www.worldsocialism.org/spgb/forum/general-discussion/marxist-animalism
Not all meat is intensively farmed, or could it's production be easily swapped for vegetarian options. For instance a great deal of sheep live in the Cheviot Hills, but I can't see anyone getting a bloody big combine harvester up Hedgehope Hill. I do agree that there is waste in industries such as this, lambs are produced for the market, but Mutton is hardly seen in the shops, for instance. Nothing wrong with a nice shoulder of mutton, when you can get it.As another example, although it is clear the fishing industry can be destructive in it's present form, would the Vegan enforcers in a Socialist Society stop me from going down to Tynemouth to catch a couple of fresh mackerel for my tea?
Veganism also rules out the consumption of insects and insect derived foods, such as honey. I'm not sure of the logic in that or the environmental harm involved either. Does anyone really think bees are sentient or suffer in the production of honey?
The shoulder of mutton was attached to a living animal. The technology exists to grow meat, which is preferable in my mind as no suffering is involved. I could not kill an animal in order to eat it and by being Vegan no one does this dirty work for me. I 'police' what I consume and do not expect others to do likewise, i.e., they choose for themselves if they eat fish, insects or any other animals. With regard to honey, I believe the Vegan Society (UK) once considered consumption of this animal product acceptable, but now do not. You can read why most Vegans eschew honey here.
hallblithe wrote:You can read why most Vegans eschew honey here.Thanks for that I read, but still don't think the arguments carry much weight. Is there any sound evidence that animal protein (how much is found in honey anyhow, surely just trace amounts) is harmful to health. And I'm still not convinced that bees can experience suffering.What is the standard Vegan response to an infestation of head lice of tape worm? How can one rid oneself without harming living creatures?
There is a romantic illusion about the issues of consuming vegetables only. Many peoples are against the killing of animals, but they support wars , they justify the killing of others human beings, and the manufacturing of weapons, and to carry arms which have caused the killing of millions of human beings.The war in Iraq, and Kuwait has killed millions of animals, and the use of depleted uranium in large quantity ( bigger than the bombs of Hiroshima and Nagasaki ) has caused animals death, and mutations, and the mutation of human beings, and the water is contaminated and the plants alsoGetting honey from bees do not produce any harms on those little animals, and honey is beneficial for the health of human beings, but at the present most of the honey are extracted from flowers, do flowers feel anything when they are remove from the trees ? How do we know that those plants are not infected with chemical fertilizers ? Cow and chickens manures are also producing diseases, and many farmers are throwing them in the waters that peoples are drinking, and they producing E. coli, cow manure, or worn casting is not the perfect fertilizer either because pasture also have chemicals, and cow eat themMany years ago insulin was extracted from the Pancreas of pigs and cows, and it saved the life of millions of human beings, as well the use of the heart valves of the pigs, and cows have also saved the life of many human being who has heart diseases and defective heart valves. They are safer and more efficient than mechanical valvesAt the present time eating vegetable is not completely safe either, when they have found ecoli in Spinach, Broccoli, and Lettuce, and in some parts of the earth the soil is infected with many bacteria that produce diseases on human beings, and the water used for irrigation is contaminated .In Central America and in the jungles of Brazil they have found several types of plants that are being used to cure cancers and for Chemotherapy, and Monsanto wants to take over those plants and used their chemical poisonous fertilizers, as well they have taken over the production of corn used to produce sugar instead of sugar cane, and sugar cane is more resistance to plants diseases than corn., and they use chemicals to produce the white color on sugarThe problem of our world is not the consumption and killings of animals, and replacing with the consumption of vegetables, our problem is the profit system, that is the one that must be replaced, and must be thrown in the trash bin of history
I guess I'm an atypical Vegan: kill those headlice and eradicate the Guinea Worm! I know of one Socialist Vegan who takes the all life is sacred attitude. I recently let him know that he can relax a little as the extermination of Guinea Worms has been delayed by them taking a fancy to dogs, and that as a result he is not going to feel obliged to act as a host in the near future! I consider the honey debate rather academic as I have not eaten any since 1989. The same is true of animal protein. I do however recall a man walking up and down Oxford Street with the placard Too Much Protein Causes Lust! By the way, the Vegan I mentioned is not without his foibles: he keeps an obligate carnivore as a pet!
Guardian is carrying this story on veganismhttps://www.theguardian.com/global-development/2016/aug/16/veganism-not-key-sustainable-development-natural-resources-jimmy-smith
Quote:Whatever our passions and whatever “side” of the vegan debate we fall on, we must overcome the temptation to find simple answers to the world’s complex and context-specific sustainability challenges. Demonising livestock is one such misguided simple response. To achieve true sustainable development, we are going to have to make good use of livestock – and all the other natural resource assets we have at our disposal – Dr Jimmy Smith is director general of the International Livestock Research Institutehallblithe wrote:The shoulder of mutton was attached to a living animal. The technology exists to grow meat, which is preferable in my mind as no suffering is involved. I could not kill an animal in order to eat it and by being Vegan no one does this dirty work for me. I 'police' what I consume and do not expect others to do likewise, i.e., they choose for themselves if they eat fish, insects or any other animals. With regard to honey, I believe the Vegan Society (UK) once considered consumption of this animal product acceptable, but now do not. You can read why most Vegans eschew honey here.Whilst I wouldn't particularly enjoy killing the animal the shoulder of mutton was attached to, I wouldn't lose any sleep over it and if through my actions several others were fed as well, I would consider it a social useful thing to do. As to the shoulder of mutton, cook it long and slow, with a little bit of water in the bottom, covered with foil, on a low heat. Or alternatively mince it up with lots of white and black pepper, a small amount of stock and make scotch mutton pies with it. Bloody lovely.
alanjjohnstone wrote:Quote:Dr Jimmy Smith is director general of the International Livestock Research InstituteThat may be the case, but that in and of itself does not mean that what he says on the matter is necessarily false.
i wasn't making any case, but simply cut and pasted the author from the article. Up to readers to decide if he has a vested interest or a bias in presenting his views.
The only ones that can save the world are the vegans and the meat eaters, or the vast majority of the human beings with the desires to establish a new society and replace this system with a new one
http://www.filmsforaction.org/articles/i-stopped-eating-animals-because-of-human-rights/The article discusses the mental effect the work has upon workers in the slaughter houses.Anecdotally, the few ex-abattoir workers i worked with were all nutters. I knew a union official who represented those at Halls the Butchers factories, and he confessed addressing their meetings always filled him with dread…after all, each carried a big razor sharp carving knife.I think we can perhaps gut and fillet a fish…maybe even skin a rabbit…or twist the neck and pluck the feathers of a chicken but anything more and we delegate the task to professionals trained in the "art" of butchery. Have we considered what we demand of them? Until we are all faced with the reality of killing sentient life, meat-eating will continue…but once slaughtering animals becomes something we are obliged to do ourselves, i think the numbers will drop…
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