“No Junk Mail”

[ALB]

Members and sympathisers who have distributed our leaflets from door to door will have noticed that some letter boxes say "No Junk Mail" (though one I came across said "No Junk Male"). Some members avoid putting leaflets through them. I always put one in, even at the risk of being shouted at. Today I got a leaflet from the Green Party through the door. At the bottom it said:

Quote:

"NO JUNK MAIL". As Greens, we appreciate your desire to reduce waste. However, we don't regard political communications as "junk mail", but rather an important part of the democratic process, helping us keep in touch with residents and letting them know directly about the work of their elected representatives,

That's more or less what I say when I get the chance (before they slam the door or tear up the leaflet). A tip, then, for those who will be distributing our leaflets up to and during the coming election campaign.

[Socialist Party Head Office]

Email received at Head Office yesterday on subject "We need to change things leaflet":

Quote:

Hello,Please respect the 'no junk mail' sticker on my letterbox and don't post your flyers through. RegardsWill

[jondwhite]

Word of mouth is always more powerful than leaflets.

[DJP]

jondwhite wrote:

Word of mouth is always more powerful than leaflets.

Well yes. But it's about getting to the point where people are talking about you. That doesn't happen if you just sit on your arse and don't go out to people…

[alanjjohnstone]

Put a fiver through the door and see just how quick "no junk mail" is forgottenDelivery posties get an additional payment for junk mail…these sods who want everybody to stop getting it are demanding posties take a pay-cut…screw them. Let them scream when their automatically sent new ATM card gets treated as unsolicited. Royal Mail policy is that people have an option to sign up to an opt-out for unaddressed mail but it doesn't include Royal Mail's legal obligation to deliver election material.  A leaflet is a calling card.  No one will be convinced by a few hundred words. It is an invitation to seek out more information and instructions upon where to go for it. 

[jondwhite]

DJP wrote:

jondwhite wrote:

Word of mouth is always more powerful than leaflets.

Well yes. But it's about getting to the point where people are talking about you. That doesn't happen if you just sit on your arse and don't go out to people…

You could try knocking on the door.

[ALB]

Just received a leaflet through my letter box from the local Green Party. The small print at the bottom says:

Quote:

If you have a "No Junk Mail" sticker on your letter box, you might wonder why a Green Party volunteer delivered this newsletter. We don't regard political communications as "Junk", but as an important part of the democratic process.

Good point. Ours too.

[alanjjohnstone]

Indeed a good point to point out And i think we, too, should also adopt this disclaimer as standard practice for inclusion in our election leaflets which are going to be delivered house-to-house. Maybe it could actually feature as the headline of one of our leaflets rather than the small-print.

[jondwhite]

At the last three events I've leafleted, each time someone has refused leaflets on the grounds they are dead trees.

[alanjjohnstone]

Is that why they are called leaflets.Any old excuse is used when you aren't interested in reading the contents. I recall during Make Poverty History, a couple of the anarchist Black Bloc declining our free Socialist Standards because we were old. 

[Anonymous]

jondwhite wrote:

At the last three events I've leafleted, each time someone has refused leaflets on the grounds they are dead trees.

Bet they don't mind reading their junk tabloids and magazines though.

[Anonymous]

Behavioral economics and user experience designer thoughts. . .you could make your leeflets and such more compelling by demonstrating socialist principles in them.  Why not turn them into a survery with return postage pre-paid and a promise you'll do something for the environement for every postcard sent back to you with information.  It's a lot more expensive for you, but a lot more welcome by the public and it demonstrates communist surveys in action.If someone sends me a postcard about some political agenda, I ignore it and use it as a placematt to eat food off of and keep my table clean and then throw it out.  I figure at least I've put it to some good that way.  If you send me a postcard with some information on the front and on the back a postage paid return mailing address allready filled out and a survery, it's fairly quick for me to just write my opinion down or check some boxes and then put it back in the mail so that you'll plant a tree for every 10 or 100 postcard surveys you receive back.   

alanjjohnstone wrote:

Put a fiver through the door and see just how quick "no junk mail" is forgotten

I agree. . .This wouild work.  Or even a significantly less valued amount of money.  In the USA there was a breif poliitcal innitiative to make all mail, especially junk mail, pay the full behavioral economic cost of mailing something.  But big busines didn't want to pay for the time they take from the public to throw away their junk mail so they blocked the "mail tax".  You're taking the worst of capitalist and use it as as you introduction to socialism.  not smart.  When you get unsolicited mail it takes time to look at it and toss it out. not much time, but it's time you've taken from the reciever and it makes people annoyed.  How would you like it if people put their important (to them) ideas in the middle of your meetings?  For junk mail people percieve correctly that you're exploiting them and taking advantage of their time and attention resources for your gain and that makes them dislike whoever sent the junk mail. 

alanjjohnstone wrote:

Delivery posties get an additional payment for junk mail…these sods who want everybody to stop getting it are demanding posties take a pay-cut…screw them. Let them scream when their automatically sent new ATM card gets treated as unsolicited. 

Did you just chanel the spirit of John Gault in this argument? 

alanjjohnstone wrote:

Royal Mail policy is that people have an option to sign up to an opt-out for unaddressed mail but it doesn't include Royal Mail's legal obligation to deliver election material. 

Legal technicalites allow you to race to the bottom.  It's true you're not doing any worse the the worst propaganda from capitalist exploiters.  People will regard you as just another politcal party putting their propaganda ahead of their interests.  Do you want to be just like the other political parties? It's not much of a sales pitch in your first introductions. 

alanjjohnstone wrote:

 A leaflet is a calling card.  No one will be convinced by a few hundred words. It is an invitation to seek out more information and instructions upon where to go for it. 

I think you're on to something here. . .I'm not sure I agree with the no one will be convinced argument.  I'd say it's more likely that few will change their minds because of a few hundred words.  People who haven't thought about the matter are more likely to be convinced than people who already have an opinion.  And some things can be communicated in a short message.  I studied advertising principles and practices a little in san francisco, and while it was morally abhorent, they know how it works and use it effectively to change minds and manufacture consent.  I like to think socialist can do better and I described how above.  BUT, lets assume your right and for most people it's just a calling card. . What's your point sending out a printed calling card. They could just look you up online.  the most important thing about a calling card is it 1) is a convenience for people who want it, and 2) it is a first and somewhat lasting impression.  People spend a lot of money and attention designing and thinking about their calling cards and a convention floor is sometimes littered with calling cards that people gave and the recipients didn't think worth holding on and just littered on the floor.  In a business it doesn't matter because if 100 people are annoyed by getting your calling card they can't do anything about it and it's just capitalism, but if one of those 100 holds on to that card it can make the card giver money.  Capitalism is great for escaping the cost you impose on others while letting you get the benefits only.  Don't be like capitalist. p.s. I could brainstorm some more effective flyers for you, but they generally all require you're oganization to more time or money on a per card basis.   However, you would get better results per dollar spent.  Not sure you're interested and maybe this is just like about the information you get in a post card.  So maybe you consider my post just a postcard for a political action recomendation?  Let me follow my own advice and ask you a survey question and see if I can turn this unwanted advertising and political opinon post into a desireable opportunity to interact.. . 

[Anonymous]

Steve-SanFrancisco-UserExperienceResearchSpecialist wrote:

Behavioral economics and user experience designer thoughts. . .you could make your leeflets and such more compelling by demonstrating socialist principles in them.  Why not turn them into a survery with return postage pre-paid and a promise you'll do something for the environement for every postcard sent back to you with information.  It's a lot more expensive for you, but a lot more welcome by the public and it demonstrates communist surveys in action.If someone sends me a postcard about some political agenda, I ignore it and use it as a placematt to eat food off of and keep my table clean and then throw it out.  I figure at least I've put it to some good that way.  If you send me a postcard with some information on the front and on the back a postage paid return mailing address allready filled out and a survery, it's fairly quick for me to just write my opinion down or check some boxes and then put it back in the mail so that you'll plant a tree for every 10 or 100 postcard surveys you receive back.   

alanjjohnstone wrote:

Put a fiver through the door and see just how quick "no junk mail" is forgotten

I agree. . .This wouild work.  Or even a significantly less valued amount of money.  In the USA there was a breif poliitcal innitiative to make all mail, especially junk mail, pay the full behavioral economic cost of mailing something.  But big busines didn't want to pay for the time they take from the public to throw away their junk mail so they blocked the "mail tax".  You're taking the worst of capitalist and use it as as you introduction to socialism.  not smart.  When you get unsolicited mail it takes time to look at it and toss it out. not much time, but it's time you've taken from the reciever and it makes people annoyed.  How would you like it if people put their important (to them) ideas in the middle of your meetings?  For junk mail people percieve correctly that you're exploiting them and taking advantage of their time and attention resources for your gain and that makes them dislike whoever sent the junk mail. 

alanjjohnstone wrote:

Delivery posties get an additional payment for junk mail…these sods who want everybody to stop getting it are demanding posties take a pay-cut…screw them. Let them scream when their automatically sent new ATM card gets treated as unsolicited. 

Did you just chanel the spirit of John Gault in this argument? 

alanjjohnstone wrote:

Royal Mail policy is that people have an option to sign up to an opt-out for unaddressed mail but it doesn't include Royal Mail's legal obligation to deliver election material. 

Legal technicalites allow you to race to the bottom.  It's true you're not doing any worse the the worst propaganda from capitalist exploiters.  People will regard you as just another politcal party putting their propaganda ahead of their interests.  Do you want to be just like the other political parties? It's not much of a sales pitch in your first introductions. 

alanjjohnstone wrote:

 A leaflet is a calling card.  No one will be convinced by a few hundred words. It is an invitation to seek out more information and instructions upon where to go for it. 

I think you're on to something here. . .I'm not sure I agree with the no one will be convinced argument.  I'd say it's more likely that few will change their minds because of a few hundred words.  People who haven't thought about the matter are more likely to be convinced than people who already have an opinion.  And some things can be communicated in a short message.  I studied advertising principles and practices a little in san francisco, and while it was morally abhorent, they know how it works and use it effectively to change minds and manufacture consent.  I like to think socialist can do better and I described how above.  BUT, lets assume your right and for most people it's just a calling card. . What's your point sending out a printed calling card. They could just look you up online.  the most important thing about a calling card is it 1) is a convenience for people who want it, and 2) it is a first and somewhat lasting impression.  People spend a lot of money and attention designing and thinking about their calling cards and a convention floor is sometimes littered with calling cards that people gave and the recipients didn't think worth holding on and just littered on the floor.  In a business it doesn't matter because if 100 people are annoyed by getting your calling card they can't do anything about it and it's just capitalism, but if one of those 100 holds on to that card it can make the card giver money.  Capitalism is great for escaping the cost you impose on others while letting you get the benefits only.  Don't be like capitalist. p.s. I could brainstorm some more effective flyers for you, but they generally all require you're oganization to more time or money on a per card basis.   However, you would get better results per dollar spent.  Not sure you're interested and maybe this is just like about the information you get in a post card.  So maybe you consider my post just a postcard for a political action recomendation?  Let me follow my own advice and ask you a survey question and see if I can turn this unwanted advertising and political opinon post into a desireable opportunity to interact.. .  

This guy want to use this forum for his fucking capitalist business. This is not a forum for business survey, this is forum for socialism. The socialists  forums are always inflitrated by CIA agents

[Anonymous]

DJP wrote:

jondwhite wrote:

Word of mouth is always more powerful than leaflets.

Well yes. But it's about getting to the point where people are talking about you. That doesn't happen if you just sit on your arse and don't go out to people…[/quote I think that DJP is totally correct]

[robbo203]

mcolome1 wrote:

 This guy want to use this forum for his fucking capitalist business. This is not a forum for business survey, this is forum for socialism. The socialists  forums are always inflitrated by CIA agents

 I dont think this comment is accurate or called for.  Its a bit over the top Marcos EDIT Here is the explanation he offers for his survey which doesnt sound to me like a "fucking capitalist business" Lets act like communist! Even if the world isn't communist we can show by our actions how communist believe in acting. . . Here's my strategy.  I'm practicing surveys which are an important part of communism.  From now on, whenever I make a comment on this website or start a thread, I'm including a request for a response on the value of my comment or thread and I'm trying to make sure I don't exploit your time with worthless discussion too.

[Author]

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