Lbird temporarily banned from ICC forum
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For those Democratic Communists with any real political interest in these issues, about "Workers' Power" and about why 'materialists' will always ban Marxists (as indeed did the SPGB), please read this ICC thread regarding 'Do stones talk to us?'.http://en.internationalism.org/forum/1056/baboon/14363/do-stones-talk-usYou'll notice that, as usual, I quote from Marx himself.Marx warns that 'materialists' will divide society into two, with the smaller part (the 'materialists') always dominating the larger part (the proletariat).That's why 'materialists' will not have workers deciding for themselves about 'matter'. The 'stones' thread explores this further.Oh yeah, Merry Christmas, and have a 'Materialist New Year'.
"The problem that LBird has presented is not therefore, his formal political positions, but the way he approaches debate and the resulting impact on the discussions that he becomes involved with.The first question is his use of continual ad hominem attacks. LBird’s constant refrain is that his debating opponents are “materialist” and therefore “Leninist” with the ultimate implication that they are Stalinist.Were his opponents defending Stalinist (or “positivist”, “Leninist” or “Trotskyist”, for that matter) positions (nationalism, state control of the economy, imperialism, party rule, repression of the working class, etc.) this might be a legitimate charge." ICCSounds familiar:
Vin wrote:"The problem that LBird has presented is not therefore, his formal political positions, but the way he approaches debate and the resulting impact on the discussions that he becomes involved with.The first question is his use of continual ad hominem attacks. LBird’s constant refrain is that his debating opponents are “materialist” and therefore “Leninist” with the ultimate implication that they are Stalinist.Were his opponents defending Stalinist (or “positivist”, “Leninist” or “Trotskyist”, for that matter) positions (nationalism, state control of the economy, imperialism, party rule, repression of the working class, etc.) this might be a legitimate charge." ICCSounds familiar:
Why am I not surprised that Vin takes the statement of the Leninist ICC to be an 'objective' statement of the exchanges between me and the ICC?Vin should also read the other link that I've provided, which gives a better feel for the reasons I was banned.I'm a Democratic Communist, who argues that only workers themselves can determine whether 'matter' is a suitable category for changing our reality, for changing our 'nature-for-us'.'Materialists', like Vin and the ICC, will not have workers deciding democratically for themselves.Hence, Vin's political agreement with the ICC's statement.
LBird wrote:For those Democratic Communists with any real political interest in these issues, about "Workers' Power" and about why 'materialists' will always ban Marxists (as indeed did the SPGB), please read this ICC thread regarding 'Do stones talk to us?'.http://en.internationalism.org/forum/1056/baboon/14363/do-stones-talk-usYou'll notice that, as usual, I quote from Marx himself.Marx warns that 'materialists' will divide society into two, with the smaller part (the 'materialists') always dominating the larger part (the proletariat).That's why 'materialists' will not have workers deciding for themselves about 'matter'. The 'stones' thread explores this further.Oh yeah, Merry Christmas, and have a 'Materialist New Year'.
I can't say I missed you all that much, my feathered friend, but I'm glad to see you haven't fallen off your perch. I hope you have a the New Year you voted for, all the best.
LBird wrote:For those Democratic Communists with any real political interest in these issues, about "Workers' Power" and about why 'materialists' will always ban Marxists (as indeed did the SPGB), please read this ICC thread regarding 'Do stones talk to us?'.http://en.internationalism.org/forum/1056/baboon/14363/do-stones-talk-us
Correction. You have never been "banned" from this forum and its likely you never will. But nevertheless, when a user continually breach the rules they will face a suspension. And you have received five to date, which in my opinion is nothing to be proud of.
Curses – I'm 5-1 down!
LBird wrote:Why am I not surprised that Vin takes the statement of the Leninist ICC to be an 'objective' statement of the exchanges between me and the ICC?They are not and I didn't. You are a liar.
moderator1 wrote:LBird wrote:For those Democratic Communists with any real political interest in these issues, about "Workers' Power" and about why 'materialists' will always ban Marxists (as indeed did the SPGB), please read this ICC thread regarding 'Do stones talk to us?'.http://en.internationalism.org/forum/1056/baboon/14363/do-stones-talk-us
Correction. You have never been "banned" from this forum and its likely you never will. But nevertheless, when a user continually breach the rules they will face a suspension. And you have received five to date, which in my opinion is nothing to be proud of.
Well, I've been 'banned' in exactly the same way here, that I've been 'banned' by the ICC, so if the SPGB mods think that those acts are something that the SPGB and ICC should be proud of…The real political problem, affecting both 'materialist' parties, is why they should ban a Democratic Communist and Marxist, for quoting Marx, and showing that the political and philosophical basis of all of their arguments are nonsense, rather than themselves explain to workers why and how, according to Marx, workers must build for themselves their 'nature-for-them'.Why do the SPGB and ICC never mention workers, democracy, socialism nor Marx, when the SPGB or ICC are discussing nature, matter, science, physics, epistemology, ontology, reality, existence, maths, logic, etc., etc.?The simple answer is that 'materialists' don't have to include those social factors in any discussion, because for them 'matter' is the root creator of The Universe. This is not Marx's viewpoint, and 'materialists' ignore Marx's views.It would be more politically honest for the SPGB and ICC to be straight with workers, and tell them that workers will not democratically create their own universe.You 'materialists' know something that workers can't (allegedly). In politics, 'materialism' is simply 'Leninism'. And its roots go back to at least 1859, with Engels' mangling of Marx's views.It's nothing to be proud of, moderator1, that your party can't argue with these political and philosophical views, which have their roots in Marx's Democratic Communism.SPGB? Dead from the neck up, since 1904?
Now, if i was you, LBird, i would be asking myself is there anything in the style of my debating rather than the substance of it that could be improved to help convince others.Have you found any receptive audience in your cyber travels?
ALB wrote:Why didn't we let sleeping dodos lie!? Sometimes we are our own worst enemy.The SPGB is a 'sleeping dodo, lying' inactive, ALB. If even your party members have recognised this, perhaps you'll stop being 'materialists', and your own worst enemy.
alanjjohnstone wrote:Now, if i was you, LBird, i would be asking myself is there anything in the style of my debating rather than the substance of it that could be improved to help convince others.Have you found any receptive audience in your cyber travels?It's impossible to 'convince' materialists, alan, because they worship their god 'matter'.They have Faith In Matter, not Faith In Workers.That's why they always turn to insults and bans, because they can't put together a political argument that involves democratic controls on the social production of our world.Marx was right – 'materialists' can't have majority rule.
Why is the Internet Committee allowing this troll to continue trolling?
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