Jeremy Corbyn to be elected Labour Leader?

[jondwhite]

Yes but for the left-wing as long as Corbyn increases public spending, even if there is a economic bust, this will be a left-wing victory.

[ALB]

What will be a left-wing victory — the increased government spending or the economic bust?

[jondwhite]

Increased government spending is what the left-wing of capital have as their object.

[alanjjohnstone]

As you would expect this weeks Weekly Worker is dominated by analyses of Corbyn. http://weeklyworker.co.uk/Vin, did you note that Corbyn will have to get down on bended knee to the Queen before joining the Privy Council and make yet another oath of allegience to her.Interesting to learn that Churchill deliberately declined to attend a number of Privy Council meetings which would have ham-strung him in his freedom of speech over government policy. 

[Anonymous]

A Very British Coup. The first 100 days of a Corbyn Government: http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/sep/14/prime-minister-jeremy-corbyn-the-first-100-days?CMP=share_btn_tw

[ALB]

Vin wrote:

ALB wrote:

So it's true what they say, that there's no such thing as bad publicity.

Probably true. Congrats to Bill and Max.

On the other hand, someone pasted this on Head Office window on seeing the front cover of this month's Socialist Standard displayed there:

Quote:

Socialist Party of Grotty Bastards. How dare you link Corbyn with Cameron and Farage. Scumbags.

We scraped it off but they they pasted it again the following night.So this does give some credence to the criticism expressed here of the cover. On the other hand it is also an example of the same sort of intolerance and intimidatory tactics reported to have been shown by independantists in Scotland towards those who disagreed with them. The downside of sudden significant changes in popular opinion.

[ALB]

jondwhite wrote:

Increased government spending is what the left-wing of capital have as their object.

I see. I thought you might have meant that they would welcome the resulting economic crisis as this would turn the workers against capitalism. But of course the Labour left are not Trotskyists.Governments can always increase their spending if they want (they control the amount of money created) even if the result may not be what they anticipate. The Mitterrand government did this in France in 1981 before having to reimpose "rigueur" (the French for austerity) a couple of years later.

[alanjjohnstone]

Message #546Perhaps if we still have a photo of this we can forward it to Private Eye and get some more publicity from them…Or we could go public to the right wing media with a press release and ask that Corbyn repudiate the actions of his more zealous supporters. Or be discreet and send a private message to his office and politely inform him of this incident and see what he does in response. Personally, i'd just forget it and put it down to experience and chalk one up for ourselves that we can still get under their skin. 

[Anonymous]

ALB wrote:

On the other hand, someone pasted this on Head Office window on seeing the front cover of this month's Socialist Standard displayed there:

Quote:

Socialist Party of Grotty Bastards. How dare you link Corbyn with Cameron and Farage. Scumbags.

We scraped it off but they they pasted it again the following night.

It wasn't me! I live 250 miles awayThat will be the attitude of most workers coming across the party. I have said it all along. This is the biggest single reason why we are small.Corbyn and Brand are attracting the disaffected and if we spend our time attacking such people we will look like 'hateful tossers'I hope this is taken into account when discussing 'Communication Strategy' We are failing miserably. Workers should be joining is in droves, instead they are flyposting our HO or calling us hateful tossers. 

[Anonymous]

alanjjohnstone wrote:

Personally, i'd just forget it and put it down to experience

That would be follyWe need to learn from it. It is only a sticker and is not abusive. Do we agree with it? Edit Just noticed grottie bastards. Then there is hateful tossers.Which reinforces the point being made on the forum by some members and non members 

[Anonymous]

ALB wrote:

So this does give some credence to the criticism expressed here of the cover. On the other hand it is also an example of the same sort of intolerance and intimidatory tactics reported to have been shown by independantists in Scotland towards those who disagreed with them. The downside of sudden significant changes in popular opinion.

It doesn't give any credence to the criticism of the front cover expressed by a tiny but vociferous minority.  Even if it did, what should we do then; roll over, soft peddle our exposure of the Corbyn circus and generally be forced into submission by the intimidatory tactics of red fascists?  I think not, anymore than we did in the 70's when the fascists of the National Front were not only daubing our windows with their intolerant stickers but smashing them on a regular basis as well which led to the decision to brick up of the front of Head Office at the time.

[SocialistPunk]

alanjjohnstone wrote:

Message #546Perhaps if we still have a photo of this we can forward it to Private Eye and get some more publicity from them…Or we could go public to the right wing media with a press release and ask that Corbyn repudiate the actions of his more zealous supporters. Or be discreet and send a private message to his office and politely inform him of this incident and see what he does in response. Personally, i'd just forget it and put it down to experience and chalk one up for ourselves that we can still get under their skin. 

Alan,Why would you want to "get under their skin"? Surely annoying people is not what we're in this for?I thought you had some sympathy with John Crump's criticism of the SPGB, as you chose to draw attention to his party circular written (link below) just before his resignation from the party (early 1970's, I think).I got the impression he saw the SPGB as detached from workers struggles, with sectarian and utopian controlling forces stifling revolutionary progress. That a true revolutionary movement does not stand on the sidelines sneering and telling workers that their struggles are wrong all the time.https://libcom.org/library/introduction-27

[Anonymous]

gnome wrote:

It doesn't give any credence to the criticism of the front cover expressed by a tiny but vociferous minority. 

So where is the majority in favour of the front cover?How would the case be watered down by turning the front cover of the Standard into a vicious attack against capitalism and its government, instead of trying trying to mimic the likes of Private Eye? We could instead pretend that we are an aggressive revolutionary organisation calling for workers to join us.At the moment we could be mistaken for being watery 

[SocialistPunk]

As one of the vociferous minority, the only thing I'm guilty of is offering a reasoned argument against being overly antagonistic to the very audience that are more likely to be open to our brand of socialism. I've even provided some evidence to back up my position.In contrast, the supporters of the tried and tested yet failing approach, offer….the same old tried and tested yet failing approach.It's been used recently somewhere on this forum, a quote mistakenly attributed to Einstein, but worth using again."Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results."

[DJP]

Of course we should use some "emotional intelligence" when dealing with people. But on the other hand this is politics and, like it or not, we are going to end up treading on toes and criticizing peoples cherished beliefs. 

[Author]

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